[ivi0nk3y]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

I'm amazed that you're ignorant enough to tag all failed relationships as the fault of the individuals concerned not trying hard enough.

I'm amazed that you're ignorant enough to not know when I am using a simplified example and have an issue with me on a totally irrelevant point.

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

And according to you... feminism is responsible for a host of societies ills. Like what? May I suggest that you stop jumping to conclusions. Or do you think that a societal ill is one in which a father CANNOT execute his daughter for dating a man whom he does not approve as is practiced in many Muslim societies (known as honour killings).

Lol you tell me not to jump to conclusions but you do the same?
What Muslim societies have you seen this done in exactly?
Oh i'm sure there will be instances out there but it is not an epidemic like you make it sound.
Just the same as a father killing his family and shooting himself dead in any Western country.
Also, didn't I say that Feminism was "partially" responsible? There are other reasons society is the way it is and I said Feminism is definitely responsible for it alongside those reasons.

Originally Posted by MissMisa

There are many other reasons the divorce rate has increased. Many of which are not the fault of feminism. Neither is the result of divorce. There are disadvantages and advantages of divorce. It's not always a bad thing, sometimes, it's for the greater good. I think for most people, divorce is a last resort. They've tried. It's not happening. Without divorce, both parties would be trapped in such a relationship. Now, they don't have to be. If you think that choice is negative, then that's up to you. It's a subjective thing to look at and it depends on what you believe in. I'm not going to tell you what to believe.

Didn't I already say there are many other factors why divorce has increased, at least twice?
Divorce isn't "always" a bad thing, which is why it exists. However it has been a problem and there are many issues resulting from the increase. I didn't say ALL divorce is bad so don't put words into my mouth.

Originally Posted by MissMisa

You can be two things at once, you know. Feminism is not a charity, a business, or anything physical. It's not like Oxfam or the Red Cross. It's just another word for a set of ideals that people can choose to believe in. If you believe in those ideas, then you can say you are a feminist if you want to. There will be feminists helping in those charities, doing things for other countries. And there will be women sat on their arse moaning about it. With one, comes the other. To say all women's rights ideals are useless, is not something I agree with.

What? Who said all women's rights ideals are useless? I can't remember saying that anywhere. Hmm.
No I said that the ideals of "women" have been reached, as far as basic rights go. I also said plenty of times that since those ideals had been met, especially in the West, that there was no more need of a Feminist movement.
What comes now is a human rights neccessity, where women who are in individual sticky situations need their issues resolved. People know that treating women like second class citizens is not right and therefore Feminism is not needed.

Originally Posted by MissMisa

And great, you've judged thousands of people by the 'the feminists I see around me.'

I am a feminist, in a way, amongst other things. When I say I am a feminist, it's the same as I believe in the rights to jobs and opportunities of women. That doesn't mean I hate men, or blame men. I don't. What has happened in my life is none of your business, frankly, and I don't have to explain those reasons to you.

Noone forced you to explain your reasons to me? I wasn't asking cos I wanted to know about your life story but why you thought Feminism was so important to you.
Yes I judged "Feminists" from what I see around me because thats what I see, through the media and through real life. I haven't met a single "Feminist" who doesn't piss and moan about her life instead of trying to fix it. They call themselves "Feminists" because misery likes company and they feel they belong somewhere. That's fine by me but don't tell me that they are around to benefit humanity in some way.
Go ahead, try and ask me whether it would be ok if other people judged terrorists the same way. I'll ask you how many terrorists you know? What issues do you know about these "terrorists" if you do know them. Why is it not the same to prejudge a terrorist? Because they have issues which still exist today.

To summarise, there should be no more Feminist movement. The majority of people know that treating women like second class citizens is bad. They have been educated and now most societies revolve around that clause.
Feminism is not some "way of life". It "was" a movement. Anyone who calls themselves a Feminist now doesn't need to. Any cases of women being repressed can be helped without needing any sort of Feminist movement.
Feminists see a problem where there is none. If there is any problem, a group of women who are being effected by it can resolve the issue by themselves through the justice system, without taking to the streets and burning their bras. If any woman is singularly effected by a problem, she can seek help through one of the many humanitarian charities that might specialise in her dilemma.
At the end of the day if you still want to call yourself a Feminist or try and justify someone else doing so, that's your prerogative. I can just go ahead and call myself a Black Panther for all the good it'll do me.