[Tsuwabuki]

Originally Posted by clintjm

"normal individuals", as you put it, clearly doesn't place the KKK into that category. Professing your Roman Catholic beliefs isn't a good idea to such people and will only bring what you ask for. Example: Professing a belief that the hiroshima bombing was such a great thing at the memorial sight or Saying a new military base in Okinawa is a great idea is not going to make you a lot of friends in Okinawa.

No, see, those examples specifically to show examples of "idiots in every country." I think you misread my intent there. I was showing that the Hiroshima guy and the KKK are clearly not normal individuals. So in this paragraph, at least, you and I agree, not disagree.

Also, when the KKK accost you outside of your Catholic center while you walk into it, you're not exactly professing intentionally, are you? Of course, picking a fight with the KKK would be stupid, but you assume much by thinking that is what I did.

Just because be treated differently as a foreigner in Japan didn't happen to you doesn't mean it doesn't happen. Excuse me for saying though, your adult short life experience and / or situation doesn't rack up the entire gaikokujin population 'special treatment' experience ratio.

No, it doesn't. However, it does mean that my experience is still mine, and that anecdotal stories without additional evidence does not pass the smell test to be used to replace it. So far none of the individuals I work with have ever experienced the kind of situations above described. Some of them have been here for ten years. They own homes and businesses. They have Japanese credit cards. I have seen their stories in person. Been to their businesses, visited in their homes, watched them use their credit cards.

I hear and read a lot of these anecdotes, but after my "short" time in Japan, I think they are caused by individual idiocy, and not some overarching conspiracy to "get" individuals of different nationalities or ethnicity. To put it bluntly, I think it's a bunch of malarky.

You were not a "foreigner" in the US. I'm saying foreigners get different treatment in Japan because they are not Japanese. Not for the reasons you describe of how you were treated in the US. If you believe you were being treated in the US badly because of race, then that is not a American trait, its a human trait.

Uhm. What? I can't follow this.

Let me break down what I was saying. I'm not a "foreigner" in Texas, but when I go to NYC or LA, I sure as hell am. Not legally, but my point here is that "legality" is not the issue. I feel more out of place, not to mention less safe, and get treated worse when I am in those cities than I do by Japanese even in big Japanese cities, let alone Fukuchiyama.

I did not say I was treated differently in the US because race, rather I said that I was treated badly because of social issues, religion, politics, philosophy. Whereas, I am not treated badly because of race in Japan. In fact, the only "racism" I experience in Japan is the patronising kind: the assumption I am a tourist or the assumption that I don't speak Japanese. This is, however, ONLY in tourist spots. This certainly never happens in Fukuchiyama. It isn't a tourist spot, so if you are not ethnically Japanese, then you are obviously a resident, and you are expected to know Japanese. As well you should be, in my opinion.

Also you don't see "racism/nationalism/xenophobia" like you do in the US because Japan is a country of one people. Its more of a day to day issue for people in the US vs Japan.

Really? Because most of these anecdotes from Westeners seems to suggest that Japanese people are racist, nationalist, or xenophobic. Or some combination of all three. Frankly, I just don't see it. I wouldn't say the US is xenophobic. The idea of a country built out of immigrants as xenophobic is hilarious. Racism and nationalism are still issues, as the Gates/Crowley/Obama/Barrett issue shows in regards to race.

In Japan, if you do speak out religiously or politically or in general "go against the grain" you will see generally the same treatment in Japan as well. Your example of the Hiroshima bomb person is an example of "going against the grain" on popular belief and was shunned and apologized by the general belief public.

Again, I am going to say here that my experiences have been quite different. This guy was totally a whacko. He wasn't someone who approached me orderly for a debate, rather he identified me as an American by listening in to the conversation between myself and my companions, and proceeded to yell at the top of his lungs in a very threatening manner. If that had happened in Texas, I would have done the same thing as the Japanese: stepped in, helped move the person to a safer location, and apologised on behalf of Texans and explained not all of us are like the whackos we still, unfortunately, have all over the US.

This is not something I need to imagine, because my grandfather held Pearl Harbor against the Japanese until his death. The family wouldn't let me tell him I spoke Japanese or was interested in Japanese culture. He was as irrationally angry as Hiroshima Guy was, and there were several issues in regards to other matters, where I did need to apologise for his behavior (an example where he called a few African-American children "damn colored kids").

These are far different situations than the very boisterous democracy in Japan, LDP, DPJ, SPJ, and CPJ are very politically different, and you should see them go during election season. There are rules, and as long as you follow the rules of discourse, your views will be taken seriously, or at least, you will be allowed to safely express our views. Religiously as well, I see Jehovah's witnesses and Mormons, along with Japanese religious groups, get far better welcomes at doors than they do in the US.

My point is that foreigners will get special treatment because they are foreigners because of their looks or heritage - just to a lesser degree because of the way Japanese society is. America in general is a more violent place pound per pound, but your unfortunate experiences are comparing apples to oranges.

And I am saying that while I agree with you, I do not agree with you to the extent these anecdotes suggest. Or rather, I don't agree it is malicious, or cause for concern, or not flatly ignorable. I just don't see the problem.

While off the subject: Is because you don't see the discourse you speak of in US online or person discourse is probably because the topic of discussion is different? I mean racism is a human trait... just because its not in discourse as much in Japan vs the US is because Japan simply doesn't deal with the differences as much as other countries.

Frankly, what I am saying is that I believe that myths and stereotypes about Japan are propagated, and are much more harmful than the myths and stereotypes propagated about Americans: in my experience the Japanese believe Americans eat hamburgers daily, are cowboys, and all own mansions. Americans believe Japanese are quiet, conservative, studious, alike, insular, and xenophobic. Both are equally wrong, but the latter is far more insidious than the former.

In general you have more freedom and can be more outspoken than you can in Japan because that is what America is about - now that we are completely off topic ^^/

If you think the Japanese have issues expressing themselves, you should meet my students. Self-expression is definitely not an issue they have, and I encourage it, and Japanese teachers are getting much better about working with non-Japanese teachers to encourage students.

As another example, Kyoto is offering non-Japanese teachers three year temporary teaching licenses while they pass JLPT 2 and take a few education courses in Japanese to obtain a permanent teaching license, and I personally have had the head of the Fukuchiyama Board of Education ask me for my opinion of western methods on dealing with violent students, and we worked to apply it in a specific case at my school. Unfortunately, we didn't succeed in getting that student into high school, be we did try. That certainly didn't feel like token inclusion.