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Sangetsu (Offline)
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01-16-2010, 02:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by WhoIsDaffy View Post
I have noticed that all those who say that man is not responsible for global warming (or even worse that its not happening [shag yer sister much?] ) talk as if the climate is a system that follows newtonian physics.

it does not!

it is a system complex to the Nth degree and one that confirms and proves chaos theory

(if you think you know what chaos theory is but dont actually know, then chances are what you think is wrong)

to give you a simpe example of the dif. between newtonian and chaos systems

in newton
I have a line that is 10 long, i add one. my line is now 11 long
after 90 steps i have a line 100 long

in chaos (and nature)
i have a line that is 10 long, add one and i still get a line 11 long
however
after 90 steps, i dont have a line 100 long, i have a green triangle.

chaos relies on what is known as feedback,
there is a nice example of Video Feedback here:
Most Trippy Video Feedback Spaced Out Mesmerizing Colors - Video

see how in the centre of the screen, the colours, shapes and movements have no direct correlation to what the hand is doing?

feedback means that a small change can have a big and unpredictable effect
this is sometimes refered to as "the Butterfly effect"
(a butterfly flapping its wings in brazil causes a tornado in Texas)

weather and climate is a chaos system, that means that though the atmosphere is becoming more energetic (getting warmer), that does not mean the immediate and localised effect is it getting gradually hotter (as newton would have us think)
if this were the case, then using modern satelite and computer technology we would be able to predict the weather accuratly on a minute by minute resolution for the next 1000+ years!

a video i recomend you watch is here:
Cambridge University - CamTV - Video and Audio - Chaos and Fractals: Predicting the Unpredictable (Part 1) with Michael Thompson
part 2 is here
Cambridge University - CamTV - Video and Audio - Chaos and Fractals: Predicting the Unpredictable (Part 2) with Michael Thompson
this will explain chaos theory to you.

once you have an understanding of chaos theory (and hopefully watched the vid)
you will understand that the sudden and almost world wide cold snaps actually show that global warming/climate change is happening. - if you dont have that understanding then you dont understand chaos, and probably didnt watch the vid.

now, as i mentioned earlier (and has been proven) that in a chaos system a small input can have a large and unpredictable output.
however it should be understood that the change of atmospheric compesition is by no means a small input.
we are the largest net producer of greenhouse gasses (FACT)
thus any change to the climate (output) due to thermodynamic changes of the earths atmosphere and oceans, caused by the release of greenhouse gasses (input) is because of man. as we are creating the afore mentioned input into the chaos driven weather system that is our climate.

also some people blame volcano's for global warming (did you get that fact from the OPEC website?)
well for a start volcanic erruptions have an overall cooling effect on the atmosphere, and all volcanic activity in the world is responsible for just under 1% of all CO2 (thats alot less than man, and also volcano's dont release methane, which humans (via cattle) do and is alot more "greenhouse" that CO2)

now to adress another issue / fatal flaw in opposition theory
a familiar quote
"nuh there was a mini ice age before its all a cycle"

erm, no.
if you understand chaos theory (again - thats what the climate is)
you will not need me to explain why you cannot use past results to make predictions on future events/outcomes/output of a chaos system.
after all: look at the double pendulum (the most simple and basic chaos system there is). if you were to look at the previous 1000 swings you would still not be able to predict the next one, let alone the next 10.

hopefully this post will have explained the non-science behind anti-global warming propoganda.
which uses newtonian models even though they dont apply.

unfortunatly i'm not going to explain the geo-political reasons why we still use hydrocarbons to this day,
and there is no single little vid or link i know to post.
so instead i will encoursge you to ask the following questions.

why do we use hydrocarbons (which pollute), when we could use hydrogen (which does not pollute)?
why do we use hydrocarbons, which are found in a finite number of places, when we could use hydrogen which is the most common element in the universe?
why do we put our economic security (through energy security) into the hands of Russia and other OPEC nations, some of whom have traditionally been "our enemies?" when we can produce more than enough hydrogen within our own country (every country) and be almost completely self sufficent in terms of energy?
why do we spend triilions on securing sources of and getting acces to oil, transporting and cracking/refining crude oil, when we could produce hydrogen locally at a fraction of the cost?

call me a cynic but i think money may have something to do with it
2009 shell profits £2.5 million per hour
2009 BP profits £1.38 million per hour
2009 Exxon profits $4.1 million per hour
etc. etc.

numbers like that kinda put the whole "global warming is a conspiracy to make money" argument to rest.
infact chances are that in the time that it took you to read this.
exxon made another $134,000 clear profit (assuming it took you 2 minutes)

not only is our reliance on oil making these companies huge amounts of money, it also gives them control.
they can decide how much your food, clothes and even water costs you.

don't be blind, don't believe the con.
its time to look further than the end of your nose.

=meh=
if you still don't understand climate change and how we are causing this.
i suggest you give up and just live your life:
you can click here
Entertainment Celebrity News Fashion Celebrities Hilary Rhoda Culture and Lifestyle - SI Vault
and enjoy the beauty of nature while it lasts
You are incorrect, man is not the largest producer of greenhouse gases, nature is. Nature produces more than 95% of greenhouse gases.

If man is causing climate change, why is it so cold this year? Why was it so cold last year? Once again, the MET office predicted a "warm" winter, not the record-breaking cold winter that the world has experienced thus far. 2010 was predicted to be the warmest year in history, but that prediction has been thrown out the window.

The mathematicians at the IPCC have used your "Chaos" theory in formulating their climate-change models. These models unanimously stated that the world should be getting warmer each year, when in fact, it has not.

Siberian tree-ring data shows that there has been no global warming since 1961, and the scientists at East Anglia's CRU have admitted that fact to each other in the leaked emails. These scientists discussed methods on how to "hide the decline" in temperatures through truncating historical data, and cherry-picking weather stations in order to show an increase in global temperatures when there has been none.

Rather than giving us a lesson on obscure mathematics which have so far only proven nothing, how about telling us why 2008, 2009, and 2010 are progressively colder when the precious math said it would be getting warmer.

By the way, Exxon is a publicly traded company, so anyone who wants to can buy share in Exxon and get a piece of that $134k. And, what exactly does Exxon do with their money? Do they put it in a bag and bury it in a hole under the chimney? No, the money is spent on research and development, exploration, and infrastructure (paying engineers, scientists, and technicians), or is invested in funds which other companies can borrow from to do the same. These engineers, scientists, and technicians spend their Exxon pay buying homes, food, clothes, and everything else. You yourself, to some degree are benefiting from Exxon's profits.

At least Exxon is able to earn a profit for it's workers, shareholders, and contractors. Do you think we should take the socialist approach and make Exxon a state company? How efficient is our government at their work? For each dollar they collect in taxes, they spend $5 or $6. Thanks, but no thanks.

Last edited by Sangetsu : 01-16-2010 at 02:17 AM.
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