[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by steven

Wow, Nyororin you give some very good information about this stuff. I'd always wondered about this stuff. It seems like my perception was similar to what a lot of non-japanese have: getting an abortion in Japan is "guilt-free" and "easy". At approx. 40万, I think the "easy" part of my assessment is wrong. That's without mentioning all the hoops you have to go through!

And that 40万 was at 5 weeks, literally as early as possible as pregnancy tests don`t show until around 4 weeks along. A week or two later would have pushed it up to 60万 (at the least.) I saw quotes starting at 120万 for ones at 12 to 14 weeks.

This helps me understand a little better why there seem to be so many 出来ちゃった結婚 recently. I know that kind of thing happens in America and didn't think it happeend in Japan, but I learned that prhase almost immediately after coming to Japan. That kind of thing seems to not only be common, but it seems to be like it's getting to be the majority (purely speculation). The fact that abortions are so hard makes this situation more understandable to me.

Actually I don`t think there is any connection. I think it`s more about procrastination and seizing opportunities.

Getting married is a lot of money. Even if you feel that a ceremony isn`t necessary and that just registering the marriage is enough - chances are the family feels differently. It`s a pain to get the money together for a wedding or to convince the relatives that not having one isn`t a total failure for the family. Throw in both sides working and you get a timing issue - when do we decide that it`s a good time to get married? As marriage almost always equals having a baby in the first year or two, it`s lumped together with "When are we ready to have a baby?" - a question that is pretty hard to say "Now!" to. This can drag out for years and years and years...

But throw a pregnancy into the mix.

The family; A girl wants to have our son`s child and become part of our family! The guy wants to be a father and is thrilled about marrying our daughter. A grandchild is in the works and our child is serious about having it! Sure, having a big wedding is best, but the stress of one on a baby isn`t good so we can easily explain the lack to relatives. Even if we don`t like the partner, they`re having a baby - we can`t toss around too much complaint as it`s our grandchild!

The couple; We do want to get married, and we do want a baby... Now wasn`t the best timing, but it`s as good as ever! The baby made the big choice for us. We suddenly have family support - we didn`t think we`d be able to make it on our own with a baby! We don`t need to worry about having that big wedding to impress everyone!

Etc etc.

I know quite a few marriages that were おめでた婚 and all of them follow this pattern. The pregnancy provided the push, not the reason itself.

Also, I remember seeing a video a few years ago (it's older than just a few years... maybe late 80's or early 90's) about this kind of thing (American Service men in Japan). It specifically talked about WWII and Korea. It had a lot of interviews of the kids and grandkids-- the so called "halfs". While the video focused on the linguistics of the word "half" and the meaning behind it, it had a lot of insight of this topic during that time period.

There was a recent documentary on about some of the children from one of the orphanages for those left behind by their servicemen fathers. A recurring theme was the mother selling all her things, either handing over the money to the serviceman for her travel or buying things he had told her she`d need to bring with her... And then basically starving to death, leaving the baby to other relatives - who also had their hands full trying to stay alive. An almost guaranteed survival for the baby was an orphanage as they were receiving aid at the time.

When these children grew up and researched their fathers, they often found that there was no chance of them ever taking their Japanese girlfriends home to get married - they already had wives and children back in the US.

My grandfather was stationed in Japan long term after the war, and he can tell countless stories about how the men were split into two groups - one side thought of the Japanese as less than human, so the women were quaint little things to have fun with then discard... And the other side that saw that as cheating on their loved ones back home, or who honestly DID want to take their Japanese girlfriends home. The ones that were serious had a wedding in Japan. The ones that weren`t would ask to be moved if they had a baby in the works, and would request their location be withheld from non-military inquiry. (The woman and her family) He said that in some of these they would decide they were sick of the girl and the two kids they had, so would ask to be transferred to another location - possibly to do the same. The women would come every day for months and months begging to at the very least be given information on whether their loved was even alive as he just disappeared one day (often with all her family treasures in tow).

There was one guy posted with my grandfather who married his Japanese girlfriend and she came along when they were moved to a base outside of Japan. Once they went to the US she went to live with his family, but he later heard she killed herself after being unable to handle the pressure and hatred lashed at her from them. I guess she sent a desperate letter - the guy got it and took emergency leave but got there a few days too late.

BUT - this is all WWII stuff. I think the situation is quite a bit different now.