[Nyororin]

Split into two posts as they`re on different subjects, and too long to put together...

Originally Posted by steven

From what I've seen, most guys don't really do that house kind of stuff. Some younger guys do, but I've never really seen older guys take care of that kind of thing. While I'm sure there are many exceptions to this rule, that is generally how I've seen it. I do want to put emphasis on the fact that younger couples seem to be more balanced (in the western point of view) in my opinion.

I think that there is a lot more going on behind closed doors than is out in the open in this area.

For the 40+ set, there seems to have been a lot of pressure from parents (now in their 70s or 80s) telling them that men should not be doing anything other than earning a paycheck, and that women should be doing the household stuff. The older you get, the stronger this is. This is the way they were raised. So there is a bit of peer pressure, as everyone around assumes this is what everyone else is doing. In cases where things are split pretty fairly, husbands don`t want to out themselves as doing a fair share of housework as that might make them look odd, or the wife look bad (as if she isn`t doing her work). The wife also usually doesn`t want to "brag", as a husband who does things around the house tends to be a sort of "dream" for parts of that age set... Or make herself look bad, as she would be thought of as being lazy and not doing her wifely job by the other segment. So unless there is some specific reason for the subject to be discussed, most people just go along with saying that their household is the same as all the others.

I think something else that cannot be forgotten is that it is NOT just men who feel they don`t need to do anything around the house. Women often have the stronger influence in this. I have seen women (50s) berate their husbands for simply being at home, as a man`s place is NOT in the house. And don`t even think about stepping into the kitchen, that is the WIFE`s territory. I think that there are countless men who would be more than happy to help out if they were asked. But it is pretty much normal for them to be basically told to get out of the house because they`re in the way.

The 30~40 something set who are married has less of the peer pressure, and different work ideals. A man who can cook and who is skilled around the house is looked on as an asset by both sides - not as lazy or annoying as is common with the older set.

What I've heard is that this has to do with tax issues. In otherwords, taxes become more leniant for part-time working mothers.

That ends this year. It was an income cutoff allowing a dependent (children has nothing to do with it) to earn up to a certain amount (1.3 million yen) but still be covered under the main earner`s insurance, pension, etc, and have only minimal taxes to pay. The main earner gets a normal tax break for having dependents ie. spouse and children.

If the dependent goes over the 1.3 million mark, the main earner loses them as an adult dependent so no longer gets the tax breaks for that person - and full taxes plus insurance and pension have to be paid.

With everything added up, either earn less than 1.3, or more than 1.8. Anything between those 1.3 and 1.8, and you lose money in the end as the loss tax breaks, normal taxes, and benefit payments end up somewhere around 40,000 to 50,000 a month.

Apparently though, this is going to change... I am not entirely sure on how, but I believe that there will no longer be any tax breaks for the main earner if the dependent is earning at all, and the level of taxes paid by the dependent earner will change. I think the goal is that there is no single jump to make a wall of sorts. I believe they`re still debating the finer points of the change.

I've noticed that a well paying salary job can cover a family. I'm sure the cost of living is cheaper where I am, but that's how I've seen it.

It DOES have to do with where you live.
A single salary can easily cover a family living in the countryside. Hoikuen is practically free, and has tons of open spots so there is little worry about paying for children`s education until they go into high school. Food costs tend to be lower as there is easier access to food sold directly from the producers, and you also get access to the "cast off" bits that tend to be sold locally at low prices.
And the biggest factor - housing. There is more space, larger living spaces, so the cost of housing is MUCH lower.

And that is assuming a lack of family support. There is also a pretty good chance that you can live with family, in the family home. Or at least receive food, childcare, and general support from local family.

Once long long ago, when my husband was close to graduation and looking for a company - we calculated how much we would need to live comfortably in the city, in the countryside, and near / with his family. Pay varies by area, so this was to be able to compare them at the same standard.

Living in the city, in a standard apartment, we would have needed a base of somewhere around 180,000/month.
Living in the countryside in a similar living arrangement, 120,000/month.
Living with family - less than 80,000/month.
(all after taxes)

Even now, at a much higher living standard than we had then, the gap is huge. In the countryside, we could buy a large, new house with lots of land attached for a bit more than half what we paid for our condo here. Schooling is about half. Food costs are different enough that it is sometimes worth it to have things sent instead of buying locally.

I think that there have been some cuts though... from what I've heard people used to get more money based on whether they had kids or not and those kinds of general circumstances. I guess that hasn't been happening as readily lately.

In companies, yes. There is less of a tendency to give bonus payments for births and the like. But this is largely because the company pays into taxes that are tossed around and end up going to the employee through tax breaks, reduced benefit costs, and the government child payments... Things that didn`t exist, or didn`t exist at the same level in the past.

I bet Nyororin has a lot to say about these things actually. I'm looking forward to seeing what she has to say about this. I was wondering if the tax thing applies to all of Japan or if it's just a more local thing. Do you know the specifics about that?

As it is national taxes, there is no difference. Some areas have slightly different cutoffs for local taxes, but the amount is usually insignificant.