Yeah...

Wasn't Vasili that same guy they made a movie about "Enemy at the Gates" where he's a sniper who never misses.

Russia did have a few heros.

Yes. From Wikipedia 'He killed 225 soldiers and officers of the Wehrmacht and other Axis armies, including 11 enemy snipers.'

You obviously read the American history. It is ridiculous - the American help and the weapon. The victory of Soviet Union is a victory of the Soviet people: their heroism, millions killed. America has opened the second front only having convinced, that Soviet Union wins war. Artful and thought over tactics. On the shoulders simple Soviet people have taken out all weight of this war. Forget about that variant of history which is formulated everywhere by America.

Both dictators have left a bloody track in history. I do not like Stalin, but the world where Hitler-was could win is awful

And who, excuse, then has started to beat Hitler? Perhaps, America?:ywave:

I do not see a point in your question other than to make it appear as if Russia played the most important role in the war. how about the lend lease act? or the daylight bomber campaign? the u.s. destroyed many german war factories and how about G.B.'s discovery of radar? was that not usefull?

Both sides played pivotal roles, in various engagements, at certain times, that prooved crucial to the over all victory. Trying to figure who's role was more important is silly since none of us really know what took place at Malta and the backroom deals that took place there.

Besides, the US was also fighting Japan at the same time, Russia wasn't. As to American history, our schools teach the next generation how evil their own country is and that they should hate their own country. In fact, I doubt any other nation teaches their own history as critically as the US does. It's almost like self mutaltion.

I wish they did get back to teaching like they did in the 40's and 50's, sure it was mostly propagandist bunk, but at least the people grew up loveing thier country.


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I have to agree my last history teacher was not afraid to tell us about mistakes on part of the u.s. He was very critical of the government to the point that he seemed biased. I don't know if i would rather have had an education where the u.s. is perfect. I like being able to create my own ideas but in this day and age it is hard to learn all of the facts. It would make it easier if people understood that you should not be anti whatever your country is because you disagree with some things it does. It makes it hard to function when everyone is worrying about political parties and elections. It is childish to make your whole view of somthing on small parts of the whole thing.

Well, I didn't want to give it a huge direction. I just wanted to throw Russia into a conversation and see where it goes...

I'm not saying Russia did everything, I'm just saying most of us are exposed only to American versions of history that often hate Russia almost as much as the Germans.

I just wanted to know what people thought about the idea of Russia playing a bigger role than most might have originally thought.

I don't ever recall my high school history classes undermining Russia's role in World War II. I see shows about the Eastern Front on American TV stations. I won't disagree though that the American/British role in WW2 is celebrated more than Russia's, but what do you expect? It is only natural to see America and Britain's role in World War II placed first and foremost in English-speaking countries - likewise, Russia is put first in Russia and former USSR states - that's how the world works. Consider also the Cold War - most western nations weren't particularly eager to celebrate Russia's military history. America and Britain and the USSR all played very important roles in World War II, I think most people know that. It's a bit silly to argue about such a thing 70 years later.

All true.

I'm not arguing about it. Just talking.

But I do think we're getting a very biased views of history taught in the west (but, no doubt it's just as biased in Russia LOL), and that is important to us today, 70 years on; if we're to learn from the past, it's important to understand it correctly.