I'm Dating a Japanese Guy shirt
 

I'm japanese and thinking of giving my girlfriend one of these shirts as valentine gift.

I am dating a Japanese guy!! (white) : Store for a lucky woman dating a Japanese guy!!

what do you guys think? do you think it's funny and good idea?

Sure, if you like your girlfriend advertising racist stereotypes about Japanese people.

Wow, how incredibly offensive...

I have nothing to say besides this.

ITT: Butthurt people.

For pete's sake, lighten up guys. Anything comedy-wise that involves the Japanese is going to be stereotypical. Actually, comedy itself is stereotypical, no matter who it involves. It's not meant to be taken so seriously.

Anywho, on topic. I lol'd at the shirt.

oh come on guys!! I thought it was very funny even though I am a Japanese :vsign: I didn't even expect a lot of people take it seriously and think it's so mean. I was kinda surprised. I don't think it meant to be offensive or make fun of Japanese in bad or wrong way, either.

I had a feeling someone would come up and say "lighten up".

I have no problem with poking fun at stereotypes, but this shirt crosses the line from poking fun to what I consider to be racist.

Let's look at some examples:

9. Concept of the word "the" is beyond his comprehension.

So Japanese people are so stupid, they cannot even understand the concept of "the". Not only is it not funny, but it is degrading the intelligence of an entire race. There is a word for that...

8. Had the innate ability to be a human calculator.

This is a dehumanizing stereotype. Yes, Japan, Korea, Singapore and students in other Asian countries tend to do better in math than those in the US and other Western countries. So instead of that being a call to educational action, we make fun of it.
Notice the use of the word "innate", implying that math skills are not due to good education, but are skills Asians are born with (not true).

5. Slices meat with a katana

That's just stupid. More Americans have held pistols than Japanese have held katanas.

2. Can't say "parallel" to save his life

Like the "the" comment, this is simply degrading the Japanese language because it doesn't have an "r" or "l" sound like the one in English. Like that's Japan's fault. It is such an ethnocentric comment to make (much less put on a t-shirt).

Even though all Japanese study English to some degree in school, many are shy to speak English outloud with any confidence. Part of the reason for that is because of idiotic shirts like this. Japanese people KNOW they have an accent in English, and don't like it being pointed out.

The shirt is racist, idiotic, hurtful and hateful.

If you disagree, ask yourself, would you wear that shirt with pride in Japan?

So would you want your Japanese mother to see your GF wearing that shirt?

Listen, you asked what people think. If you don't want to hear the answers, then don't ask the questions.

Stereotypes are stereotypes because in some small way, they can be true. The problem is, several of these 10 ways are not true at all. Raw meat? Sashimi is one thing, but you will never see Japanese people eating raw pork or beef. MMM covered the Katana, but there are more.

Also, hair and body products are on the rise among male American preteens and teens.

Right, cause katana's and being super-humanly smart are horribly, racist things. How dare they :rolleyes:

Great. Lets.

Saying the Japanese speak horrible English isn't racist. Not the funniest thing in the world, but very very far from racist.

And thus, it's funny. It's saying it is like they were born super smart. I find it hard to see that as racist, or hell, I don't even see that as offensive! The only negativity found in this example was put in place by you rather than actually being implied by the example.

OH NOES! THEN IT MUST BE TOTALLY RACIST AND OFFENSIVE!
Japanese + Katana = racist?
As said before, the only negativity here was brought on by you.

Same with the "the" example.

I must ask, if you were to create a list similar to this that wasn't "offensive", what would be on your list? :)

The simple word "the" is said to be beyond Japanese comprehension. That isn't the same as saying they speak horrible English. "Very far" from racist? I don't think so.

So you think it is funny to compare Asians to computers?

This discredits their education and excuses Westerners lower math scores by dehumanizing Japanese by throwing our hands in the air and saying "They are inhuman! They are computers!" The fact that math skills are higher in Asia compared to the West is not "innate"...it is thanks to good education. But this shirt wants to promote that old stereotype that Asians are born calculators.

No, this one is just stupid.

Anytime you are making a list of stereotypes about your Japanese boyfriend's antics you take the risk of delving into racist stereotypes. Unfortunately more than zero items on this list delve into that area.

I'm gonna have to agree with MMM on this one. I love racism in comedy, I think it's hilarious. Russel Peters is my favorite comedian and all he does is make fun of Asians and Indians. But some of these are just degrading, and really not funny...

I wouldn't get it if I were you.

well in fact Japanese people eat a lot of raw meat except for pork. however we eat row beef called Yukke, raw chicken called Torisashi, raw horse meat called Basashi. Japanese people love eating this things. You may wanna try if you're interested in. but anyway i think this one is meant to be sexual at the same time.

I would say that the OP is just trying to sell these tees. He has the same link on his profile!

Action time, mods!

Yes, raw beef and raw chicken grade meat is available, but I haven't met any Japanese that eat these dishes "a lot". It is more of a now-and-again treat.

How is saying your boyfriend puts raw meat in his mouth "sexual" in a way that you would want her to wear it talking about you?

This is a little bit of a ridiculous argument. Everyone has a different opinion about what's racist and what's not. Also peoples sense of humor vary. So no one is going to win, just agree to disagree and let that be that. :)

No Trinket, I don't think so. Comments disparaging other races based solely on being that race are racist. That isn't a "ridiculous argument" because that implies that whether or not comments are racist is strictly negotiable...and that isn't the case.

There is overt, and covert, but racially offensive is racially offensive. Just because you don't see it, doesn't mean it isn't there.

Isn't the case...in your opinion.

You're right racism is there but prejudice is natural for people in general.. and it happens to be everywhere.
Personally, I find the shirt stupid and not funny and people who think it's cool to date a certain race rather...oh what's the right wording, blank minded?

The thing is, those who are prejudice stick to that view no matter what you say or do, it's wrong but it is also a lost battle. There are more important issues to worry about in the world of racism, not dumb teenager style shirts.

How so? From what I gathered, it meant the Japanese say something like "He is student" instead of "He is the student". Maybe it's just me, but that sounds a bit like bad English.


Srs bsns right hurr!

Yes, actually, I think it is very comedic to compare Asians to computers. They are smart on average, and we know that. The shirt never said they were inhuman.
It pretty much says Asians were born smart. Please, stop overanalyzing it.


Along with every other thing that depicts a Japanese person with a katana - including the countless times I've seen this in anime? Sure, call it stupid, but it's not offensive.



The thing is, no matter what, there will always be a stereotype, and there will always be someone there to overanalyze it, just as you have here.
If you were to list "He eats fish very often", I could tear it apart and list the countless other things the Japanese eat besides fish. I could even go as far as to say for listing that you are intolerate to fish and find it repulsive and weird compared to your own diet, and are making a racist and offensive comment by listing that, despite the fact that the Japanese do eat a lot of fish.

The shirt isn't the funniest thing in the world. I'm not going to go posting it on Facebook to show off or something. It's cute, and nothing more or less than that.

I am not sure what you are getting at. It is my opinion, but I am right?

I never think fighting against racism is a lost battle. Older folks might have their opinions cemented, but racism among younger folks is usually rooted more in ignorance than a long history of "experience".

Dealing with it at the "teenager" level is much more valuable than at the geriatric level. Teenagers are smart enough to be able to change their minds.

News to me. I have never seen this, heard this, or experienced this. No one has ever offered it, even when eating entirely traditional Japanese meals. I would not say it is widespread, and that's all I meant by the fact it fails as a stereotype. I'm positive the majority of my students would find eating raw meat to be... unappetising at least.

It sounds a lot like "bad English" and apparently it is incomprehensible to Japanese.

Are you going to force me to explain myself again?

Yes, the shirt removed their humanity with the word "innate". If it had said "Thanks to my boyfriend's education, he is like a human calculator"...which is more accurate (maybe...certainly simply being Asian does not make a person smart or like a calculator) but is less "funny" (in disparaging Asians way).

I am sorry you think it is funny to compare Asians to computers. I know many Asians that are offended by this comparison...(especially as children living in the US).

It is stupid, as I said, but put yourself in the shoes of a Japanese who has been asked how many samurai swords he owns.

Sometimes the person saying it makes a difference.

Yes, it is not a racist call to arms, but it is based on nothing but ignorant stereotypes.

We can work to support stereotypes or work to try and eliminate them. I feel comfortable working to eliminate them. I hope you are comfortable doing what you are doing.

In my experience it is very rare, and I doubt that was what the shirt was referring to.

I meant I agree with your opinion but it's still just your opinion.

Teenagers are also not to always be taken so seriously.

Everyone's opinions are their own, but when it comes to opinions I have found that teenagers are generally not so stupid as to be rigid in their beliefs for the simple reason they know they don't have a lot of real world experience.

It is easy to educate a 50 year old about something new, but hard to change their mind about something old. Teenagers (and even 20-somethings) are a little different.

There is a fine line between jokes that poke fun at race-related things and are funny and jokes that make fun of other races and lack taste. It is odd that so many people here don't see that this shirt falls into the latter =/

I would assume the sequel would include things about buck-teeth and terrible vision because that isn't racist at all either :rolleyes:

You are right, Jesselt. I agree 100%.

DIS SO FUNNY



WHY YOU NO LAUGHING???

MMM, why all the Torches and pitchforks?

I don't think it degrades the race, I think it shows a terrible difference between English and Japanese. This is a stereotype at best, and near close to a fact. Most Japanese, including my wife, has the occasional slip up with "the". Frankly not many native speakers of English can explain properly when to use "the".

I don't know anyone who could use this as hate or calling a race stupid, because that peson doing this would simply have to be flawless in the Japanese language to not be a hypocrite.

I watched many primetime Japanese comedy variety programs that destroy the foriegner's use of Japanese in grammar and in accent. My wife does it to me at every chance.

At the same time you can turn on a network like G4TV "Attack of the show" and watch their insane takes on Japan. No rasicm, no hate, no dehuminizing, just takes on how different
Japanese and American ways are so different.


That the Japanese are better at Mathematics because their educational system leans towards science and mathematics more than the U.S. is "dehuminizing" to Japanese?

So in contrast, the shirt says Japanese are too stupid with "the" and too smart "with mathematics"?


No sterotyping on your part here with America and Guns.


Same reasoning of the above "the" example.
I guess you don't like the Engrish joke books or blogs either?

Yes, and I can't say Ryori or Ryokou without a grin once in a while from friends or family. Also can't say Konnyaku without people knowing if I'm saying engagement or root jelly.

Actually I believe many like to have their issues with pronounciation pointed out so they can correct and practice their faults.


Wow, thats quite a list of complaints.
I disagree. It is stupid. But I think you are reading way too much between the lines.
People throw around the words racist and hate way too easily these days.
Hurtful is a matter of opinion.

Its kind of like watching "Gung-ho" with Japanese in Japan and then "Mr. Baseball". In both cases Japanese will chuckle at both because they realize the differences.
Now watch "Lost in Translation"... serious stereotypes on both sides, and both sides laughing at their differences.

Are those movies hateful, dehuminizing and racists?
No.


I could probably go to Harujuku and find someone wearing this right now. I could go into a specialty shop in Tokyo and probably find like t-shirts.

I personally wouldn't wear one, but nor would I wear shirts with "I'm with Stupid here" either. Its a geek thing. Its stupid, but it hasn't got a nazi swastika on it like you making it out to be.

However you make a good point: I wouldn't wear them in the U.S. because of the state of ever running political correctness the country has been in for a while now. It would probably go over better in Japan.

Personally the lime green colour is too much.

Descriminating by generalizing with Physical traits is another thing.

An old war political cartoon from WWII is in bad taste today, just as Japanese attacking with slurs as "round eyes" etc.

This T-shirt isn't even close to this. Its no more harmful than Engrish blogs.

I really do appreciate your adlibs to the cartoon though.

If anything get her the thong or briefs.... no one will care what is written on it.
If they can read it, and have something to complain about, they are too close anyway.

Advertising what race you are dating on a T-shirt is a bit strange though.
Again in the states, you will always find a wacko to make a something out of nothing because you are fraying the edges of political correctness.

It is good to see you want to bring a discussion from another thread here from the get-go.

But I have already answered the question you are asking.

So would your Japanese wife appreciate you wearing a shirt making fun of her accent and mistakes in English?

I have asked this question in three ways now on this thread, but no one wants to answer it.

English speakers that speak Japanese do not make fun of Japanese speakers of English. Why? Because they know how hard the other language is.

It is people that don't speak a word of Japanese that find humor in making fun of native Japanese speakers' accents. The stereotypes promoted on this shirt are based on ignorance, not education.

So turnabout is fair play? They are racist against us, so we have a right to be racist against them? That seems like a good strategy to eliminate racism.

What does "Attack of the Show" have to do with this t-shirt?

Wow. I have to say it again?

No.

Calling it "innate" is.

Crap. I have to explain it again. It says Japanese are too stupid to understand "the" but are "innately" calculators.

You don't see the problem with that?


Oh, now I am the a-hole for stereotyping?


engrish.com and those type of websites are one thing, but to whitewash a race, a country, a continent... is something different. Engrish.com (etc.) gives specific examples of English mistakes found in Asia. That is a little different than saying a Japanese person could not pronounce "parallel" "to save his life".

So how would you feel to see someone wearing a t-shirt pointing that out specifically?

I know how I would feel. Not so great.

On joke t-shirts? Sure.

If it is racist, then it is hurtful. That is a matter of course.

How in the world of logic can you compare Mr. Baseball, Gung-Ho, and Lost in Translation to the dehumanizing comments of a t-shirt with less than 100 words?

Really, please.


We are going to play the Nazi game? Really?

That's when the argument just ends. I can't say this shirt is Nazism...so therefore it has redeemable values? No....

This shirt is racist and just not funny. I would be ashamed of anyone I knew who wore it in Japan or in the West.

It is sad that people would actually pay money to promote the outdated and misinformed stereotypes shown here in the guise of "humor".

I have to agree with MMM here.

I've never really been one for racism or stereotypes on shirts. Especially the ones mentioned here. They could have easily listed 10 things you may expect to find in japan or 10 things a typical japanese guy would do, that wouldn't be offensive. Or at least less so.

It is all the same: in bad taste.

I totally do not get the level of defense being put up for this shirt, posted likely by it`s maker to get more hits and sales. (Joined just to post the link to this shirt? Looks like spam to me, really...)

It is in poor taste. Somehow because the subject of the stereotyping and poor taste is Asian/Japanese it is excusable. I have no doubt a lot of people would take offense to a shirt with the same level of stereotyping and poor taste if it were another race. Try making a shirt saying anyone black eats fried chicken and watermelon at every meal, and that they can`t say "ask" correctly "to save his life" - see how many people think it`s all just humor.
But Japanese are free game apparently...

I am married to a Japanese man, and I seriously would never even touch such a shirt let alone buy and wear it.

Excuse me?;)

Sure making fun with the right friends or one's spouse can be done.

"I think I'll stetch my leg".
"don't you think you want to stretch them both?"

It is wrong in our book to not correct each other, else how would we learn.
A little humor in between doesn't hurt.
However I wouldn't advice this approach to a stranger or student by direct correction at the time of fault. Having it posted on a T-shirt is a different thing.

Again like the "I'm with Stupid" T-shirt. Just bad taste.






This is true but friends or the spouse does; more so with an accent, but still in the end its only out wanting the other to improve. We usually get a laugh out of it.

No, I think the T-shirt DID get the sterotype correct. The "The" and "L and R" issues are real problems that most Japanese have to overcome with English.

I see where you are coming from though on this point, as one without knowledge of the Japanese language may think they are just stupid leaving "the" out, problem with plurals, "L and R". But for anyone to think this is from stupidity or ignorance show that persons ignorance. By putting some thought into it, one can conclude it stems from a difference between the languages though.

Seriously ... you are taking this to the extreme. There isn't any racism here.


Innate or not, again in one part they are saying they are sterotypically smart and the other sterotypically dumb. If the innate part is true, then that makes the rest of the world innately stupid towards math.

I assume "innately calculators" means born well at math; which anyone knows no one race is born well at anything. This can go back to physical traits of the race where black races were once thought to be better at particular sports. So if anyone states that anyone is born with calculus in their genes it is obvious that they are the one that are ignorant.

Again you are reading way too much into it. Its an exaggaration. Its like saying "born to swim" "born to run" "born to ride".

At least you admit stereotyping Americans on that point.
No you are not and a-hole, but just pointing out you were sterotyping while demonizing the shirt for the samething.

Engrish with the R instead of the L is the same point on the t-shirth.
Its the same thing.

Most people that would read a shirt like that not knowing the Japanese language differences wouldn't get the joke, the one that would understand the joke would probably laugh because it happens often. Most Japanese I know would too. Most people I know laugh about the hurdles and silliness of things they can't do. The ones that don't feel so great will most likely continue to practice to correct their issue.

Its a different thing if the shirt was talking directly to someone with this problem and was laughing at them for it, but it isnt; because its just a shirt. Even if one would laugh at them for it, it just shows the one laughing in a lower light.

This isn't racist though. Stereotyping at worst and basically showing Japanese language difference with English.


My pleasure: All three movies have the following in common: Japanese Cultural and Language Stereotypes played on the big screen in comical fashion. All three had Japanese language stereotypes all through it phonetically and grammatically with some screwed up idioms. The "the" and "r and L" "good at math" points on the shirt played to these same comical routines in these movies.



Oh PPPPLLLEEEASESE MMM.
Guess you didn't like those three movies either. Would you be surprised that all three of those movies have played in Japan with moderate success and not being banned.

The come back to anyone seriously trying to put a Japanese person with these English language problems is always "oh, so you are fluent in Japanese?" Again, no one is going to do that.... because it would make them a hypocrite or just a mean Japanese language fluent non-Japanese.

Many Japanese co-workers I know have laughed quietly at another Japanese when they have to speak English to a customer etc because they thought it was bad. Sometimes, the speaker included will laugh, and sometimes this just eggs him on to practice more; in any case he accepts his faults as we all have to. Its not that the co-worker is stupid, they just aren't as gifted as another Japanese in Language and phonetics as another. Some say Women are better at languages than men in general....
anyway my point is, most Japanese would probably chuckle or agree a bit in their head if they were to read the shirt points on "the" and "r and l"; and maybe at some others.

Why would a Japanese person care what a foriegner that doesn't truely get the attempt at humor on the shirt thinks?

Thinking of buying the coffee mug now.
Nah..

True but its the first time Spam has ever ignited such a storm.

Japanese would not disagree the public must have rice as part of their diet and do try to include it with one meal a day. Thats not a sterotype, its a fact. The Black people fried chicken and watermelon is a true stereotype because it isn't a fact.

In general, many foreigners will admit they can't say foreign words "to save their life".

I agree its sterotyping. I can't agree there is racism, hatred or dehuminization in it like some have posted. Nor posting old war hate propoganda with wonderful handcrafted adlibs in comparison.

"Right friends" or "one's spouse" is different than advertising the same feelings on a t-shirt, isn't it?



And that is worthy of a joke on an American T-shirt?

If this shirt is meant to be an educational tool, please let me know now. I don't see it that way.

"By putting some thought into it" one would see this shirt is in poor taste.

The racism is clear and bold-faced. The denial of the offensiveness of it is what I would consider extreme.

You have no idea how offensive it is to be told your brain is not like a human, but a computer.

Exactly. To say one race is "innately" made to do one thing in 2010 is going to be considered a racist statement because it is not based in fact.

If they don't "get the joke" then that kind of shirt only promotes the stereotypes you are defending.



Really?

I have seen Mr. Baseball, Gung-ho, and Lost in Translation multiple times, and each of these movies DEALS WITH stereotypes in their own ways.

This shirt does not DEAL WITH stereotypes...it just propagates them. It promotes them. That is the difference between a movie and a t-shirt.

Clint, wow.

Yes, Many Japanese eat rice two or three times a day...no one talked about that one as a stereotype.

I don't admit to not being able to say "foreign words" in Japan...because I can.

Please, don't make me the bad guy for posting an example of post-war racism. The fact that this crap is accepted is the problem.

Pretty much all stereotypes are founded in some way in reality. I don`t think this makes them okay to propagate.

Yes, but there isn`t a well known stereotype attached to that. I highly highly doubt that anyone is going to think "Harhar, that`s funny because I can`t say foreign words well either!" It`s most definitely just going to go into the "l and r mix up is so hilarious!" bin.

You have said that if someone thinks about these things for a moment they would get them as stereotypes and humor... The thing is, people don`t think about them... And even if they did, I believe you`re giving the average Joe too much credit. Maybe you live in a very international community - a lot of people do not. I know that I have had MANY a "joke" made to me at the expense of my husband, almost all based in stereotypes and ignorance... And these people were definitely not going to "think about it" and make a connection to the reality and reason behind some of these stereotypes.

It doesn`t feel very funny when people laugh and ask you if your kid is going to be a "normal person" or grow up like "one of those Japanese drones". It doesn`t feel very funny when people make jokes about your husband with L and R interchanges.
Stereotypes add up, and I have been told that my son has medical problems because his father was a "monkey"... I have also been asked if he makes me say "I ruv you rong time" before having sex or makes me wear a school girl uniform. It`s all stereotyping, and it`s not very funny when you`re on the receiving end of the "joke".

There may be a place where you can laugh about this shirt - maybe in family, or with the right friends, etc... Things are different between friends. But I am willing to guess that 99% of the time, it isn`t appropriate. That is what I take issue with. 99% of the time, it`s going to be people on the "outside" laughing at the expense of those on the "inside".

I'm going to buy it just to be the first.

What % of cotton I wonder.

10. Eats rice with every meal.
Can be considered sterotyping. Every meal is EVERY meal. Japanese do not eat rice with every meal all the time. No human does that. You are not offended but maybe somebody will be. You pick and chose apparently.

I'm not sure if you comment came out wrong or what, but I'm glad you don't have any of those tounge twister words or names. I come across them now and mispronounce.

Your war poster posting was is seriously way out of context. This shirt was nothing of even close your war posting. Look like during the war actually: War Savings. In any war Racist hatred is not on the same level or close to this shirt. It is nothing in comparison to what you posted with the war stamp poster thing with colorful handcrafted adlibs.

This is now a project for me. I'm going to get some opinions from Japanese and English (both familiar with Japanese language/culture and not). See what they think and feel.

Okay, setting aside the war propaganda, let's instead consider one of my favorite films, that still was deeply offensive in the way it treats asians:

Sixteen Candles' portrayal of a Chinese foreign exchange student (as portrayed by a Japanese-American actor) is pretty bad. In retrospect, it could not be done today. It is on the same level, in my opinion, as this shirt.

Of course, then again, John Hughes movies are very over the top when it comes to all social groups: one of the reasons they're awesome.

Not only is this shirt offensive, it's pretty stupid as well. Two thumbs down in my book. Offensive and funny is one thing, offensive and stupid is just pointless.

The fact that they have it on a MATERNITY shirt, now that's funny. Can you imagine walking around Japan, with an offensive shirt, nine months pregnant, saying you're not even married!

You never really explained yourself the first time.
Though since you're not putting up an argument here, I'll let it slide.


Innate ability =/= Inhuman
Mixing these two is entierly your opinion, and it seperates why you find it offensive and I don't.

I'm not sorry that I find it funny. Humor is humor, and just because you find it offensive doesn't mean I'm going to feel bad for laughing at it. I know many Asians that would buy this shirt on the spot if they saw it.

*puts self in Japanese person's shoes*
I could kill you with my katana. :cool:
*steps out of Japanese person's shoes*

The Asians I know would probably laugh along with me at that. Say whatever you want, but it's neither racist nor offensive.


What I am doing? Defending comedy? Sorry, but this shirt is as harmless as it gets imo. I can't argue against something I don't find offensive.

You can't eliminate stereotypes. It's impossible. When someone says "dirt" and you think of the color brown, it's a stereotype of dirt. The human mind works off of stereotypes. If you're truely working to eliminate stereotypes, then you're wasting your energy. Do something more progressive, like educating people on other cultures.