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-   -   GEOS Goes Bankrupt (https://www.japanforum.com/forum/general-discussion/31613-geos-goes-bankrupt.html)

Sashimister 04-21-2010 02:58 AM

GEOS Goes Bankrupt
 
GEOS, one of Japan's largest English conversation school chains with around 400 schools filed for bankrupcy just a few minutes ago. Not that I'm surprised, I thought to let JFers know as many members always seem to be discussing teaching English in Japan, (even including mere dribbling tourists!).

Tsuwabuki 04-21-2010 03:02 AM

I feel sorry for the teachers, including one here in Fukuchiyama, but good riddance! GEOS has a terrible track record in regards to labour disputes, and stonewalls both union activities and even court or Labour Board imposed injunctions.

jesselt 04-21-2010 03:02 AM

I wonder what they were doing that caused them to go bankrupt...

Just another reason why people should stick with JET. The Japanese government probably isn't going to file for bankruptcy any time soon.

Columbine 04-21-2010 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesselt (Post 809256)
I wonder what they were doing that caused them to go bankrupt...

Just another reason why people should stick with JET. The Japanese government probably isn't going to file for bankruptcy any time soon.

They wouldn't need to. They could just jettison the ALTs and drop the program. They already have in Kobe, more or less. Over 70 ALT places reduced to about 20. Never mind that their admissions process is now a bloated whale of nonsense.

MMM 04-21-2010 02:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Columbine (Post 809290)
They wouldn't need to. They could just jettison the ALTs and drop the program. They already have in Kobe, more or less. Over 70 ALT places reduced to about 20. Never mind that their admissions process is now a bloated whale of nonsense.

Not going bankrupt, but the number of students has dropped and schools are closing. They are also realizing after so many years that just having college degree does not a teacher make.

Tsuwabuki 04-21-2010 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM (Post 809318)
Not going bankrupt, but the number of students has dropped and schools are closing. They are also realizing after so many years that just having college degree does not a teacher make.

Exactly. Unlike my small little dispatch "company" (really just one guy who negotiates with the BOE). We've all been here between two and five years, with no plans to leave, and with good teaching evaluations, and some of us had previous teaching experience.

It does matter who you hire. Gee, I wonder why.

WeeFugu 04-21-2010 07:05 PM

I believe it is bankruptcy is it not?

http://headlines.yahoo.co.jp/hl?a=20...00546-san-soci

Quote:

Translated:
GEOS English major (Tokyo) on Monday announced the start bankruptcy proceedings. Management and preservation of property order received from the Tokyo District Court on Sept. 20. According to the provisional administrator net debt is about 75 billion yen in the end of March this year.

Nathan 04-21-2010 07:20 PM

Although it did get me over to Japan for a few years, I believe the entire eikaiwa industry itself is a sham. Lack of qualified teachers, lack of actual educational material, etc.

From my brief experience, most of the people who took eikaiwa (and only eikaiwa) classes did not improve their ability, or their improvement was marginal. They would have been much better off taking a course from an actual certified instructor.

WeeFugu 04-21-2010 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nathan (Post 809338)
Although it did get me over to Japan for a few years, I believe the entire eikaiwa industry itself is a sham. Lack of qualified teachers, lack of actual educational material, etc.

From my brief experience, most of the people who took eikaiwa (and only eikaiwa) classes did not improve their ability, or their improvement was marginal. They would have been much better off taking a course from an actual certified instructor.

100% agree, and I also used Eikaiwa to get over there. I moved over to ALT after that, where I felt I made a much bigger impact as I was in charge of what was getting taught. I worked for a certain British English school that will be unnamed, and they were simply awful. Though, I met my wife there. Yes that is right...I am a teacher who pulled one of his students, but for the record...her course was finished, so it was kosher! Hehe. :D

Sangetsu 04-21-2010 11:52 PM

I am very familiar with Geos, I have a few friends who work there (one of my GF's friends was Geos' top manager in Japan), and we hooked up for drinks last night after the big Geos meeting in Nihonbashi.

The problems with Geos had nothing to do with the quality of the teaching, as far as conversation schools go, Geos probably has the best teaching method and texts of them all. Geos' problem was it's management style and high overhead costs.

Geos managers had to endure incredible pressure to enroll new students, renew old students, and do what they can to meet the school's goal each month. The head office calls every day and questions managers about their progress and their plans for the day. As a result of this pressure, managers typically quit after 2 to 3 months. Typically, about 4 of 10 Geos schools have no manager, which makes enrolling and renewing students difficult. Added to this was the high cost of the administration. Though most of the individual schools have been earning a profit, it has not been sufficient to cover the admin costs.

Late last year Geos finally changed some policies, tried to keep a manager in each and every school, and revenue increased. Unfortunately, a few months ago the company which owns the Geos schools in Australia went bankrupt. Even though the company running the schools was an Australian entity, the bankruptcy damaged Geos' credit, making financing their operations through the year impossible.

As things stand now, a company called G Communications has purchased Geos. Of the remaining 320 Geos schools, about 100 will be closed. The remaining schools will reopen on Friday, with all staff now working for G Communications.

G Communications is the same company which bought out Nova after their bankruptcy. From all that I hear, Gcomm seems to have a better management style and business strategy, and will probably be a better company to work for than Geos.

Sangetsu 04-22-2010 12:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tsuwabuki (Post 809321)
Exactly. Unlike my small little dispatch "company" (really just one guy who negotiates with the BOE). We've all been here between two and five years, with no plans to leave, and with good teaching evaluations, and some of us had previous teaching experience.

It does matter who you hire. Gee, I wonder why.

Are you aware that under Japanese law you are only supposed to be contracted via your dispatch agency for only one year? And that after that one year your BOE is supposed to hire you and pay you directly? All ALTs who work for the same dispatch company for over a year are being screwed. Your dispatch "agency" is taking about 1/3 of your money, and probably kicking back a little bit to the members of the BOE. Your annual contacts are worded in a way to them appear legal, but in substance, they are not.

This is ALT dispatch agency teacher-scamming scheme is another matter which is going to have to be resolved in the future.

jrisjerry 04-22-2010 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM (Post 809318)
Not going bankrupt, but the number of students has dropped and schools are closing. They are also realizing after so many years that just having college degree does not a teacher make.


Is there any problems on their teaching ways or the school rules, why the students reducing all the time?

Tsuwabuki 04-22-2010 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sangetsu (Post 809373)
Are you aware that under Japanese law you are only supposed to be contracted via your dispatch agency for only one year? And that after that one year your BOE is supposed to hire you and pay you directly? All ALTs who work for the same dispatch company for over a year are being screwed. Your dispatch "agency" is taking about 1/3 of your money, and probably kicking back a little bit to the members of the BOE. Your annual contacts are worded in a way to them appear legal, but in substance, they are not.

This is ALT dispatch agency teacher-scamming scheme is another matter which is going to have to be resolved in the future.

I know all about inaku. I've investigated rocking the boat, I am a member of a union, and have discussed a plan of action quite thoroughly with the union and my coworkers. I am aware of the legalities, my rights, and what the BOE should be doing.

I make more than some of the JTEs. At the moment, given my good relationship with the BOE and the person through which the inaku is set up, and given the facts that my Japanese is still not where I want it to be to change over to a Japanese teaching license, and am quite comfortable financially... There just isn't a reason yet for me to lead the charge.

Trust me, I am quite informed as to the dubious system in place. Due to the tiny size of the company, I am not inclined to consider it a problem personally yet. If I stay in Japan much long, and I intend to, I will expect direct hire.

xyzone 04-22-2010 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sangetsu (Post 809371)
Unfortunately, a few months ago the company which owns the Geos schools in Australia went bankrupt. Even though the company running the schools was an Australian entity, the bankruptcy damaged Geos' credit, making financing their operations through the year impossible.

So this just another event that stems from the bad global economy.

Sangetsu 04-23-2010 12:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by xyzone (Post 809478)
So this just another event that stems from the bad global economy.

Exactly. Countless businesses across Japan have closed down over the last 2 years, and many others have been downsized. Many factories have reduced their work weeks to 4 days, while salarymen at other companies have had their pay cut.

On the bright side, Japanese exports are up for the 4th straight month, but it'll take at least another year before the dust settles here and companies begin hiring/expanding again.

jbradfor 04-23-2010 02:50 AM

Interestingly enough, many well-known English language schools in China are also closing: Problems at Kaien language school

TalnSG 04-27-2010 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MMM (Post 809318)
Not going bankrupt, but the number of students has dropped and schools are closing. They are also realizing after so many years that just having college degree does not a teacher make.

It does seem the system is being cleaned out; maybe for the better, maybe not.

A few weeks ago I sat through a recruiting presentation by one of the major companies still sending ESL teachers to the Pacific Rim from the U.S. since I am considering amping up my teaching cert. to do some ESL teaching in the U.S.

To say that I was stunned by the poor quality of presentation skills of one of their "exemplary .... experienced" teachers, is an understatement. If this was an example of who is teaching for them I would be embarrased to be associated with company. Had this person been one of my Speech 101 (Basic Public Speaking) students, they would be struggling for a passing grade.

I hate for economic to be the cause of restructuring an industry such as this, but when nothing else seems to be addressing the problems sufficiently this is frequently the result.

sarasi 04-28-2010 12:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by butterfly320 (Post 809932)
Usually when companies go bankrupt, many people appear on the scene and say “that’s no surprise”.

Someone always knows that the deal is going down badly.

Actually it was obvious from about the middle of last year that Geos didn't have long to go- all the symptoms were there, and if you look at other Japan/ESL related sites you'll find that lots of people predicted it. Anybody who was surprised must have had their head in the sand for a long time.

I think people blaming the teaching quality for the collapse have it wrong though- just like Nova, it was largely poor management and a very flawed business model exacerbated by the economic downturn that caused Geos to go down, not the skills (or lack thereof) of the teachers. Just like with Nova though, you can be sure that the management will try to put as much of the blame for the failure as they possibly can with the teachers.


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