Historical Japan Question.

[CIAOfficer]

During Japan's isolation period, they faced the very thing the entire earth is now facing on a smaller scale:

A creation with the unlimited ability to breed and reproduce, placed in an area with limited (in their case VERY limited) food, resources, space, and time.

Is there any lessons from that period that the rest of the world could learn from today?

[Columbine]

Originally Posted by CIAOfficer

During Japan's isolation period, they faced the very thing the entire earth is now facing on a smaller scale:

A creation with the unlimited ability to breed and reproduce, placed in an area with limited (in their case VERY limited) food, resources, space, and time.

Is there any lessons from that period that the rest of the world could learn from today?

During Japan's isolation period disease was also rife, and infant mortality was high. There was also a more disproportionate spread of the resources, with the poor being much poorer and the rich being much richer. Fish stocks were better in the past. They also had a lot more little wars which helped keep the population on an even keel, people still frequently killed themselves, and sometimes samurai murdered peasants 'just because' and natural disasters were just as common as today, only with bigger impact on people's lives. And how was time limited exactly?

[Nyororin]

Err...

First - any culture that developed has been, at some point, in the same situation. I do not believe there has ever been a population that did not face some limit on all those things. (Well, with the exception of time. Time is limitless.)

Secondly - Japan was not as limited as it may look at first glance. There were far far fewer people. The limits that existed were more related to technology and government.

[Ghap]

Originally Posted by Nyororin

Err...

First - any culture that developed has been, at some point, in the same situation. I do not believe there has ever been a population that did not face some limit on all those things. (Well, with the exception of time. Time is limitless.)

Secondly - Japan was not as limited as it may look at first glance. There were far far fewer people. The limits that existed were more related to technology and government.

I hate to play devils advocate but that second statement contradicts itself.

Limiting tach and goverment is limiting a society...hence the rapid change during the Meiji (sp) period.

The only other example i can think off is when the chinese burnt there fleet of ships, so hardley the norm.

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by Ghap

I hate to play devils advocate but that second statement contradicts itself.

Limiting tach and goverment is limiting a society...hence the rapid change during the Meiji (sp) period..

The original poster is asking specifically about limits in "food, resources, space, and time." The limits that existed in Japan at the time weren`t related so much to an actual limit in the resources available - they were related to limitations in other areas. Mostly development, really.
With what the original post was asking about - resources and space - the size of Japan isn`t really as big an issue as it appears to be to modern eyes as the population was much lower. In a closed environment, resources control the population - there was no group of people suddenly dropped into an area, breeding out of control, and unable to secure resources.

[Ghap]

Ok i stand corrected as you say the OP stated certain criteria.

Although even within these criteria exceptions still apply

Sakoku (鎖国, "locked country") 1633- 1850 ish.

Many hardships were faced but as with the OP's criteria lets look at food

Tenmei Famine
Tenpo Famine

to name just 2.

Now this is hardley unique as many countries in the world suffered famines tho I dare say an argument could be made that if Japan was not in a period of isolation things may have turned out different.

Again im just playing "devils advocate"

[JohnBraden]

Originally Posted by Ghap

I hate to play devils advocate but that second statement contradicts itself.

Limiting tach and goverment is limiting a society...hence the rapid change during the Meiji (sp) period.

The only other example i can think off is when the chinese burnt there fleet of ships, so hardley the norm.

Wouldn't that change during the Meiji period be due to outside influences?

[CIAOfficer]

All good points. After their isolation period, they were able to reproduce more, and experienced a large population growth.

If you put that into a global situation, short of aliens, there is no more space or resources to gain access to. What limits our population from growing? A what about the competition for existing and known resources.

BTW- Time is not limitless...we have an average of 70 years.