Learning kanji
 

Im learning kanji and would like advice on learning it efficiently. What do you think is the fastest way to learn kanji???:confused:

Arigotou.
KudoSan.

Fastest Way to Learn Kanji
 

Hi,

Not to sound like a smart-a##, but the fastest way to learn kanji is to get pretty fluent in spoken Japanese first.

Think of kanji as "pictures" in picture frames.

To put the frames on your wall, you need something on the wall to hang the picture on. A hook. Without the hook, you can try as hard as you want to hang the picture, but it won't stay on the wall.

The "hooks" that I'm talking about are words. Learn the words, become familiar with how they're used, remember them, and then you'll have plenty of hooks on which to hang your pictures. In other words, learning the kanji is much easier if you already know (and can use) the words that they represent.

I've never know anyone to become fluent in Japanese by trying to learn how to read and write first.

Start with roomaji (English characters representing Japanese sounds). It's a quicker path to fluency, and thus kanji reading and writing.

Now, assuming you already have a pretty good level of fluency, I'll tell you how I learned how to read and write kanji.

Practice, practice, practice.
Write, write, write.

And then write some more.

Every time I learned a new kanji character, I'd write it down between 50 and 100 times by itself, while saying the "on-yomi" ("Chinese" pronunciation).

Then I'd do the same thing with all of the different "kun-yomi" (Japanese pronunciation), again, saying it as I wrote it.

Then I'd write the kanji in different compounds (generally Japanese nouns are made up of two or more kanji characters), and again, say the word as I wrote it.

Sound like a lot of time and effort?

IT IS.

But it works. I earned a B.A. in Japanese at almost a perfect 4.0 (while working on a Master's degree in accounting) using this method for all of my classes where we learned to read and write Japanese. The spoken classes weren't too bad, since I had lived in Japan for a while before finishing college (again, that fluency thing).

So buckle in, because to my mind, it's the best way to learn and retain written Japanese.

It also happens to be pretty much the same way that Japanese people learn how to read and write Japanese. And again, they don't start reading and writing until they have some fluency built up. I believe Grade 1 is where you get the first 80 kanji characters.

A word about flash cards.

Meh.

They're OK, but they should be used to support the learning style I described above, rather than as a primary learning method.

Why don't I like flash cards? Nothing personal. Flash cards never stole my lunch money or kicked sand in my face. But, they only help with recognition, not spontaneous language generation.

Being able to read and being able to write (by hand, without a dictionary nearby) are two completely different animals. One is tame, and the other hasn't been housebroken. It's a dangerous beast. It'll poop all over your carpet.

But...if you're planning on only ever using a computer to write Japanese, then I guess flash cards might be ok, since writing on the computer is basically an exercise in recognition (the kanji candidates are brought up in a list by the computer's brain, not yours).

You can ask the "keitai" (cell phone) generation in Japan right now if I'm right about recognition vs. spontaneous generation. Keitai could well be the death of Japanese kanji...we'll see.

I know...kanji is cool. I think so, too. But I've got 20 years of experience in learning and using the language, and I didn't start until well late in my teens, and I didn't turn out too bad (language-wise, at least).

Hope this helps

haha that was more than an explination... but more of a book on learning kanji.

simply put, speak japanese, read japanese, write japanese, then practice a lot and memorize it.. wow and that was all in one sentence.

raverboy

That's a great response.

It seems like computers can help us do tons of things, but some things it can't do is 1) translate from English to Japanese, or vice-versa and 2) make true kanji learning any easier. The reason why is you need to WRITE the kanji to really get it stapled into your head. I beleive it is faster to WRITE a kanji (using Learning's technique) 100 times, then to take a on-line flash card test 1000 times (which is what it would take to fasten down that synapse).

In this day and age, your opportunity to write kanji (in letters, etc.) is diminished, but the "old-fashioned" learning styles are still the best way to learn.

Use the internet to communicate, find out things, chat, etc... but not to memorize kanji. That is a challenge there is no shortcut to. It's you and your testbook, pen, and paper.

I agree with every thing but the Romaji part... I in my personal experience have found that if you learn the romaji before your kana it is more difficult (takes more time) then you would if you when right to the kana. Though also believe that everyone learns thing differently. I just seems to flow more smooth. Yes if you are online and have no chance to hear what each means then I think you should learn the romaji, before kana but try to learn it at the same time if you can.

Leaning Kanji as Amazing said is no easy task. but if you keep up your studies and work hard you can accomplish almost any thing.:vsign:

Romaji is detrimental to learning Japanese. Learning the proper kana is one of the few things you can learn properly over the internet, as there aren't that many characters and they aren't that complex. As for kanji, I agree with those who've said writing is the key. Writing the kanji versus just looking at the kanji makes a world of difference. Drill, drill, drill, practice, practice, practice.

I (Unfortunately) first leaned Japanese this way. But I Worked hard at it... so well in fact I forgot how to read Romaji correctly hahah:D

IMHO, the problem isn't *learning* kanji... is actually *remembering* them.
You can spend hours on textbooks, kanji lists, flashcards, writing, remembering stroke order, practicing every yomi possibile... but if you don't use them often, you won't remember them.
At least, that's what is happening to me. If I don't practice everyday I forget kanji very easily.

To effectively learn kanji,
Write them over and over, in context so you know hwo to combine them with other characters./kana, knwo the meanings and the readings. :) Good luck!

I agree with the premise of what the first responder said, especially the bit about hooks. You need to link that Kanji to something.. and yes, of course logic would suggest that you should link the kanji to the Japanese word that you have/will become so familiar with.

But, I think you can develop ties with those Japanese words from the Kanji; in other words I think that you want to be getting into the Kanji soon, like now!

The method that I advocate comes under a lot of scrutiny from some students of the language, mainly those who have attained a very high level with the Kanji using a different method. The main reason that it comes under such scrutiny is because... it doesn't teach you the readings straightaway (shock-horror!!), yes, you won't be learning how to read the kanji from the get go. So if we don't have a reading what do we link the kanji to? An English keyword.

Then, when you come to review.. you look at the English keyword and then write the kanji. How do we do that?? well we break the kanji down into manageable primitives, assign a name to each primitive and make up a little story.. maybe something like this:~

1 Kanji:
恐 = Fear

3 primitives:
工 = Craft
凡 = Mediocre
心 = Heart

1 Story:
Fear is the craft of the mediocre heart.

OK, so not all kanji have such "easy to work with" primitives.. but the premise is still there and still works, trust me.


In short; the concept of this book is to give you such a powerful familiarity with the kanji, that you just happen to be able to write them from memory; the book can totally be completed at a reasonable pace in about 6 months; the author recommends that you shouldn't study readings alongside... that's not something you have to do, I took and passed JLPT3, and Kanji kentei level 8, whilst studying the book, and after roughly one year of study (Kanji study), I took and passed the Kanji kentei level 6 (825 characters) and I hope soon to be passing level 5.

Anyway, everyone learns differently and it won't be suited to some, but I think it deserves a look:-
Remembering the Kanji: James W. Heisig

Also, a must, to go along with the method/book is this website designed to take care of all your reviewing problems for you:-
Reviewing the Kanji

First 276 characters in ebook form; if you do nothing else please just follow this link and read the introduction to the book:-
Remembering the Kanji: VOL. 1

practice, practice, practice

Kanji is a pain the arse but it is not impossible - I found that, once I had maybe 200 under my belt, I began to learn really quickly as I could start reading things (and, living in Japan, I have the opportunity to read LOTS of things in kanji haha)

Kanji
 

Yeah, I would have to say I'm not a fan of this method, but if it works for you, more power to you. I'm not one to be militant about learning methods.

I do recommend staying away from kanji until you're more fluent in Japanese if your goal is overall fluency. I've just seen too many people give up when they try it the other way around, and I've seen too many people become very successful Japanese speakers very quickly when they go the roomaji route.

Learn hiragana and katakana, if you want. Not a big deal, but just remember:

ningen = person
にんげん = person

But in the end, you throw both versions out and learn the kanji:

人間 = person

So the reality is that kana or roomaji are both basically crutches (OK, you will get more use out of kana in the future, but you know what I'm sayin') until you learn the kanji anyway...

I rode this horse (i.e. learned Japanese and kanji this way) to pretty good language success. Passed the JLPT Level 1, did well in my Japanese degree, used/am using the language professionally, etc.

BUT (big but), I also understand that people can have different styles of learning, so just be aware...

Have a goal. If what you're doing doesn't seem fun or take you in a direct line to your goal, then change tactics (e.g. if flash cards don't work for you, try writing, if writing doesn't work, try a computer game, if that doesn't work try something else). Find what you like, and work it consistently...as long as it takes you toward your goal.

Thank you all for your great advice. :)

Arigotou tomo dachi.

Domo arigatou, very good words of advice. Even I am not fluent, I do try and write as much kanji as I can consistantly so I can try to deeply root them in my memory. I just think if you try to learn TOO much kanji, in my case you just get frustrated and confused. So Taking it slow helps.

By the way LearnAmazingJapanese, I looked at your profile and saw there was a blog attached, is that your blog? If so its great!! Also I envy your JLPT1 rank. Kudos to you mate!

Blog
 

Yeah, that's my little corner of non-real space. Been too busy lately to update as much as I'd like, but I'll put something else up there in a day or so.

When I started learning Japanese, I was pretty much thrown into it by moving to the country with minimal language study beforehand. The hardest part at first was picking out the words from all of the sounds, so my blog is my little attempt to help people get an "ear" for the language.

Hope it helps.

It sure does help mate. Hope other JF people use this valuable and enjoyable resource :) cheers mate

I agree. Learn kana and then go on from there. I started with romaji and I spent a month trying to learn kana and it just didn't work for me. It just went horrible. Until I found this flash site for kana and it took me like 2 days to learn it. I havn't done katakana though.

Ive learned　ひらがな and カタカナ and all the ろまじ　for them. If Im fluent in both of them, do I need to be fluent in the whole Japanese language to learn kanji efficiatly?

Well, if you are fluent in Japanese it will be easier for you to connect in your mind the words you already know to their writing in kanji.
But you can also learn kanji, its meaning and its pronounciation without being fluent in Japanese.
It's the same, some people prefer the first method, some like the second.

But I think that learning first romaji then the two alphabets, is a terribile way to learn japanese (this is true also for every language which doesn't use roman alphabet, such as russian, arabic, thai, etc.).

I think you learn alot from learning the kana first because you learn which consonants the Japanese use and which sounds they do not use. Makes it easy to spell out westerner katakana words too. I.e. BUS - ブス (BASU)

I use
Amazon.com: Remembering the Kanji: A Complete Course on How Not to Forget the Meaning and Writing of Japanese Characters (Manoa): Books: James W. Heisig, and

Amazon.com: Kanji Study Cards: Books: James W. Heisig
boxed set of 2,042 flash cards contains full information on kanji including Chinese and Japanese readings, English equivalents, and hints for vocabulary building.

lol. 'ブス' means a completely different thing. 'Bus' is written as バス in Japanese.

Ha-Ha-Ha! I can't believed that he actually mis-spelled the katakana for 'bus'. 'ブス' is one word that you don't wanna use unless you wanna get slapped at.