Working hours
 

I often hear that the working hours in Japan are very long. I know two people who live in japan and they work usually from 9 till 10-11pm. I was wondering though is there overtime pay in Japan?

I often work 12-14 hour shifts... we have no overtime rates, but huge (equivalent to 2-4 months salary!) bonuses twice a year instead

What's the work atmosphere like in Japan.

IMHO
it very much depends on the company.
a rule of the thumb is that the bigger the company the shorter r the working hours. it also depends on ur status within the company. today many people r not regular employees, but rather contract staff or paid by the hour. these ppl usually don't work that many over-time hours or if they do, they get paid. there r however many exceptions as i am certain that ppl will tell u about.

concerning over-time pay, it is a tricky area. apart for employees where it is stated that they shall work long hours, such as shift system, over-time pay shall be paid, if, and this is important, the company is over a certain size and if the employee is not a manager of any sort. some companies take advantage of the especially the last exception, labelling many as management even though the r clearly not managers. mcdonalds have apparently used this and were recently fined in court.

remeber that the above is only "in principle" and as i said, ppl can probably give u plenty of examples where neither have been adhered to. the biggest problem i see is that the over-time hours r never registered. on the other hand working long hours doesn't necessarily mean that u work hard, i have seen plenty of inefficient workplaces.

haha yeah the local makku has like 80% of its workers as managers so not to have to pay them overtime, in Japan you are supposed to express your love for your job by working extra hours for free, sometime the boss will take people to dinner and for drinks its kinda pay because you don't have to pay for dinner. I went to Wakayama with a friend and she had to cut our visit short to meet with a work related person on her day off, the Japanese actually have a word Karoshi which means death by over work, it happens here!

Japan seems to have a very good work ethic, just on an extreme level if compared to the US. I wish I had that much work ethic, but I guess I still haven't found the right job for me as of yet. Of course, I do know that if I ever end up over there as an ALT, I'd make sure to show that I have lots of work ethic to make a good impression. ^_^

I`m going to second that it all has to do with the company.
Currently, service overtime is considered illegal - your company cannot ask you to do it. They can, however, draft a pay plan that accounts for longer working hours without paying hourly overtime - by putting it into your bonus, etc.

My husband`s company`s hours are 9 to 6. Anything before or after that is overtime, and is paid in 15 minute increments. He also receives 2 set bonuses and a 3rd bonus based on the company`s success during the year.
Depending on the season he leaves work anytime between 6 and 12.

What if you choose to work more hours even though you're not being paid for them? Would you get praised for doing so, or would they insist on paying you? I know you said it probably depends on the company, but what would normally happen in this type of situation?

Chances are, nothing. They aren`t going to stop you from dedicating your time to them. Some places might praise you, others might pay you, others might add it into your bonus, and others might not even notice.

imagine you are a Japanese POW, kinda like that I guess...

No joking around and don't even think about saying anything but an agreement of some kind to what your boss says,. regardless of how wrong they may be...

um, people don't WANT to be worked like a slave...it's just part of the culture so you have no choice lol

Yeah, I know. I was pretty much comparing the cultures. IMO, the US lacks work ethic and the only people I've ever seen really into working, even later hours for no pay, are those who actually enjoy their jobs or ended up with jobs they seeked out. I was just saying that I've yet to find a job like that, but, if in Japan, regardless of the job, since I know it's a part of the culture, I'd try to show that I have a lot of work ethic to make a good impression and to show that I have respect for the company and of the culture.

I remember on one of my trip, my cousin (A Creative Manager at an advertisement firm) wasn't home when I arrive at 11:00PM. I heard him walking in the doors around 2:00AM, he left the house already the next morning when I woke up at 6:30AM.

Similar things was seen when one of my staff was sent to Korea for a design flaw we had, the staff there literally asked him "Leaving already" and looked at the clock, it was 1:00AM

I think we had it easy here in north ameria, there are just enough work to make people work that kind of hours in Asia...

Americans have no lack of work ethic, and put in more hours than Europeans, on average. Yes there are times when all-nighters are required in any field, but I get worried that people have this impression that Japanese people work 20 hours a day and Americans just sit around all day. The cushiest job I ever had was in Japan, and even then I got a part-time job at night to fill my days...

Charts from the American Time Use Survey

karoushi.. jeez, still came up on my mind whenever I close my eyes.. sometimes, people just can't stop from what they are doing.. result in overdo..

Maybe work ethic wasn't the right term to use. The Japanese come across as appreciating their jobs more, imo, compared to the US, regardless of what it is.

Traditionally, Japanese worked for one company their whole lives, and in return, one is completely dedicated to that company. That isn't as true today as it was 20 years ago, though I would say that Japanese, as a rule, are more respectful and dedicated to their companies than Americans are, but there is a cultural vein to that.

For example, at a conference you would never ever hear a Japanese person complain about his boss, for example, or his salary to someone from another company. An American wouldn't think twice about doing that. It's not right or wrong, just different.

There's give and take to that. I know Japanese that have never been on trips as a family. There is no sense of loss about that, it's just that tourist vacations as a family aren't as big a priority as they are to Americans.

But I do agree with your revised statement.

I don't know if it's necessarily that Japanese work more.. I think they just do a better job compared to "Americans"
And I quote Americans because it's not Americans actually doing the dirty jobs, most of the time.

I want to offer my opinion to the opposite of this.
They don`t necessarily do a "better" job. Unless we`re talking about the driven innovators, they are often so tied down in office politics that it`s difficult to even get the most basic things done.
Even if someone above you doesn`t really have any part in the decision you are making, and even if they are in a different department... You still have to show respect by waiting for their opinion. I can`t even begin to count how many times my husband has spent half his workday (or more) doing "maintenance" type work while waiting for someone, somewhere, to call him so that there is no break in the respect.
It`s definitely not efficient, but when you`re going to likely spend the rest of your life working around these people - it`s important. You can`t just up and quit, head over to another office and be hired.

Treating people with respect is a form of doing a better job.
And no one can deny that Japaneses are much more respectful then Americans and when you ask for something to get done, it gets done with no evidence of half ass.
Or at least in Okinawa.

Absolutely right, and I wonder where those that don't think Americans are good or efficient workers base that opinion on...especially those that have never been a part of the American workforce.

Efficiency is far from a priority in the Japanese work place. Look at the court systems. Remember the OJ case and how it took over a year. It took the Japanese courts a DECADE to rule on Asahara Shoke, the leader of the Tokyo Sarin Gas Attack.

It's not that.
I was discussing minimum wage jobs.
I've been part of the American workforce since I was 13
And what I've seen is that Americans, or foreigners with American jobs, when their paid low wage they tend to let alot of things slip in the cracks.

While Japanese do not.
You can tell this by even looking at how clean Japanese buildings are vs American buildings.
And of course this doesn't apply to all of those two categories.

That's what izakaiya's are for though!

Most of the buildings out here are pretty filthy... I guess the humidity doesn't help that though as it just eats into everything!

Seriously, you are wasting your time putting Japan on a pedestel and America in the bin - ALL countries have good and bad points so don't think Japan is 100% squeeky-clean just because things are easier to sweep under the rug and pretend they never happened out here!

I think you are right that in minimum wage jobs in the service industry you probably see a better attitude from workers in Japan rather than in the US.

The reason is that Japanese feel like they are a part of a team, even if they work at a fast-food restaurant or at a gas station. Americans don't feel that sense of "teamwork" at that level of job. This us a cultural trait that goes very deep in Japan.

Seems that was the case in the US too many years ago. A person could work with a company until he or she retires. Seems it's not the case much now.I guess I'm a "different' person. I'd never complain about my boss at such a place. I'm a suck up for the most part. My boss tells me to jump, I ask "how high". lol Complaining about pay, that seems to be very common, and working in a school, I'm hearing it more and more from the teachers there.That's interesting. I couldn't even imagine not taking a family-based trip, as a kid of course.

I agree with that, and I feel that the main reason for the lack of "teamwork" thing might have to do with trust. At the job I have now, as sad as it sounds, I have no trust for any of my coworkers and feel very alone there. I don't want to work with people I have no trust for, but since I have no choice, I grin and bare it.

I really wish I could find a job where I did feel like I was a part of a team or important to the company. Every job I've had, I've only felt expendable.

So in Japan you would never ask for a raise?

I did (and got it as I was working well outside of my contract)... though I don't work for a Japanese company so might be different

What jobs might a foreigner be able to do in japan with any kind o degree F.X. what did you do in japan and how was the work ??

Theoretically with a 4-year degree you are able to apply for any job. It's getting hired that is hard. If you have long-term visa status that is going to help (basically married to a Japanese) otherwise your choices are going to be limited to language teaching. There is also IT work available, but jobs that don't require fluency in Japanese are harder to find.

My mothers working hours are 8 to 4 but she often works overtime. She may work from 8 to 6 or 8 to 8 sometimes even until 10, but she will clock out at 4 or 5 and work overtime for free.

Is that how it generally is in Japan?

In my experience, non-salaried people don't work overtime off the clock nearly as much as salaried employees.

Salaried? What does that mean?

That means you have a set monthly pay, and you are not paid by the hour. Hence the "salary man" who works 12 hours a day. Doesn't matter how many hours you work, people on salary don't have overtime.

My father is known for working 80 or more hours in a week since he is always on call. They pay overtime and also even double time after 80 hours.

I was wondering if there was a minimum wage in japan.

Not sure how accurate this is, but I got it from Wikipedia

In Japan minimum wage depends on the industry and the region. The lowest minimum wage for a region (Miyazaki) is ¥4,712 (~US$47.34) per day, and the highest minimum wage for a region (Tokyo, Kanagawa, Osaka) is ¥5465 (~US$54.91) per day. The minimum wages are set by the Minister of Labour or the Chief of the Prefectural Labour Standards Office. Recommendations are made by the Minimum Wage Council

okay so the highest seems to be about the same as in america. that is if the work day is 8 hours. if its longer than 8 in japan then it's less.

Every time I hear someone say this it makes me cringe.
It`s simply NOT correct.

A salary is a set amount of pay for a set number of hours of work each month. The standard is 8 hours of work a day on every workday for the length of the month. Generally around 170 hours, depending on the month. The salary is SET pay for every month - so even if there is a month full of holidays where you are only working 120 hours for the month - you`re still going to be paid the exact same amount as the month where there were 31 days and no holidays.

Anything over the set hours is indeed overtime. It is illegal to ask an employee to work over the set salaried hours for free. They must be paid for it.
There is nothing against an employee thinking that working for free might impress a boss or get them a salary raise based on dedication, etc - So in the end working free overtime is an employee choice. (And depending on the industry will actually do the opposite of impressing superiors...)

Working a salaried job is much better in the long run than a "by the hour" job, as your pay is guaranteed even if there is no work for a month. You will still be paid that set salary amount even if the boss calls it a day and lets everyone go home at lunch for a few weeks. (Which happens in some industries during slow periods.)
Salary or not has absolutely nothing to do with overtime.

The normal workday is around 10 hours - 8 hours of work, 1 hour for lunch, and 30 minutes before and after work for various things. When there is a lot of work, it can become much much longer. But anything above the normal workday is considered overtime.

ETA; Ack, I didn`t notice the year on that comment when I replied. Ouch.

I know I know...