Nicknames, petnames (for persons of opposite sex)
 

I'd like to learn japanese words or terms that work well as a nickname to call a girlfriend, the way we in america we call each other "Honey" or "Sweetheart."

This issue came up with a girl I'm dating. I'm a gaijin she's a native japanese we both live in the U.S. She's been here over 10 years but hasn't done much dating.

I'm just naturally the kind of person that uses lots of slang and nicknames when addressing people I know. Some people do that kind of thing more than others, I tend to do it more than most. Admittedly, I do it A LOT. People who know me take it in a fun, friendly way. I never mean any disrespect, my friends don't mind.

It was early in our relationship when I noticed Saori didn't respond well to anything except her name. If I called her "Sugar" or "Gorgeous" etc, she just eyed me warily. One day she asked me if I had called other girlfriends these names. She gave me a little speech about how she likes her name because it's unique and special, especially so in here in the US. She never directly said she didn't like these other names, but positively stated that, for now, I address her by her given name.

I mistakenly thought she wouldn't want to be called a recycled nickname, or maybe didn't want me using terms of endearment which may cause me to recall previous lovers. Later, I found out this guess was wrong.

As a side note: at this point Saori didn't know that I had previously been in a relationship with another japanese girl who positively loved it when I called her "Bijin." So I tried it out on Saori, thinking she wouldn't suppose that I had used that particular term before. I addressed Saori as Bijin a few times, but could tell she didn't like that any more than "Honey" or "Sweetie."

Over the next few months we learned about each other and each other's cultures, etc. She witnessed my massive propensity for calling everyone some sort of nickname, and she got to see in their responses that there was never a shred of disrespect in this habit of mine. I learned from her (I kinda already knew, but got reinforced on) the tendency for Japanese people to be a bit more formal.

One recent incident was where she got into a Facebook chat with a friend that she hadn't talked to in 12 years. Saori explained to me that the friend, who was one year younger than Saori, opened the chat by addressing Saori as Sempei.

This led to a discussion about how, early in our relationship, Saori stated her preference to not be called any nicknames. In this discussion Saori explained that even after decades of marriage, her father NEVER addressed his wife as anything other than her name.

So Saori's preference to not be called a nickname had nothing to do with using a recycled petname or recalling past relationships. She just wasn't sure how to take it when I called her "Sugar." She asked if I had called previous loves these nicknames as a point of reference of american culture in general and my behavior in particular, not because the reasons I had previously supposed.

Referring back to the FB chat, it seems that Saori was concerned that my habit of calling her one of those names is sort of opposite of her friend calling her sempei. She didn't know one way or the other, but was concerned that my nickames were lacking in respect. And that's the reason for asking if I had called other girlfriends these names. I told her I had, but this was small comfort at the time and she still preferred her name.

She didn't know how to take being called these nicknames partly because she didn't know me.

Where we're at now, she's warming up to the idea. I still call her by name more often than not. But occasionally "Honey" or "Bijin" slips out and she's fine with it.

So here's what I'd like to know now. Does anyone have suggestions for what japanese nicknames or words I can use in the way that americans do?

I directly asked Saori what would be the japanese equivalent of the word "Sugar" to be used in addressing a girlfriend, as a way to reference her being "sweet." She came up totally empty. I said, what's the japanese word for "sugar"; she told me; I asked how well it would work for a man to address his girlfriend with that word; she just said it would be awkward and not work at all.

I'd really like to know a handful of japanese words that would work well as cute little nicknames. I would really like to surprise her with some terms that actually work in the context of the japanese language and culture.

Not sure if it matters, but here's a little more biographical data on her. She's 37 years old and grew up in Okinawa.

Have you ever considered that it might have nothing to do with nationality and it could just be that your girlfriend is the sort of girl who just simply loathes pet names?

I mean, just to throw it out there; I'm not even remotely Japanese and certainly my dad has never called my mum a pet-name, and i can't stand them either. Especially at the start of a relationship. Sorry, but any first date who calls me 'sugar' immediately gets a first strike. Way too presumptive, and I agree, not very respectful.

sorry I cannot help with japanese terms of endearment.

If you have a habit of using nicknames a LOT-- it seems it really is sheer habit to want to use such a word with your present girl friend.

Why not call her by her name?


I remember a time when maybe the aristocracy/ actors, actresses would always refer to friends etc as "DARLING>" Really it was meaningless-- sheer habit. considering that the word "Darling" should be precious and meaningful of loving the person you call Darling.

"Babe" seems to be common here now-- but special relationships need meaningful words--not just habitual words or expressions that really do become meaningless.


SUGAR or HONEY is SOOOOOOOOOOO Sweet.

omae, kimi, Saori, Saorichan, Saorichin, [last name]san,


No sweetheart or honey in Japanese.

No one calls anyone "bijin" as a nickname in Japanese.

You understand "sempai" is not a nickname. It is a term of respect.

You are essentially asking "How do I force my habit of calling people by nicknames on someone who doesn't like it?"

You have two choices: force her to change, or honor her wishes. The choice you make will depend on how much you care and respect her.

thanks to all who have helped
 

chiuchimu - thanks old timer. Seems like you're the only one who kinda gets what I'm about and you're willing to help.

To everyone else - well I didn't come on here to be judged, lectured, misunderstood, etc. Nowhere in my post am I asking for relationship help or analysis of my habits or motives. I'm less concerned with defending myself than I am wanting to stand up for my girlfriend. Some of you have made a mistake that I would be loathe to commit myself in person: to underestimate her.

Everything I could say in her (and my) defense is included in my opening post. I totally understand how a quick read of my lengthy post carries the risk of misunderstanding my habits, intentions, treatment of people in general and my girlfriend specifically. But lets not underestimate my girlfriend's ability to stand up for herself and not subject her life to a boyfriend who fails to show her proper respect.

Lets start with my habit of using nicknames. First and foremost, I always treat everyone with the most respect that I can. I'm generally casual but NOT one of those thoughtless, overbearing individuals that immediately calls everyone I meet by some nickname, and doesn't realize that I may come across as offensive.

"I'm just naturally the kind of person that uses lots of slang and nicknames when addressing people I know. People who know me take it in a fun, friendly way. I never mean any disrespect, my friends don't mind."

"It was early in our relationship when I noticed Saori didn't respond well to anything except her name."

Columbine wouldn't tolerate anyone calling her Sugar on a first date. Would, or did Saori? I said it was early in our relationship, certainly not our first date so I don't know where that came from.

And yes, I had considered that it might have nothing to do with nationality and it could just be that my girlfriend is the sort of girl who just simply loathes pet names. But nowhere in my post is any indication that she is the sort of girl who simply loathes pet names. Quite the opposite. It turns out that at most she had a mild apprehension or maybe suspicion about them. When I say she "didn't know" how to take that sort of address, she "didn't know" what to read into it, I mean precisely that: she didn't know.

She was questioning my past behaviors, using treatment of previous girlfriends/wife as a yardstick of how she was being treated. She was wondering if, for me, this practice was typical in the context of american culture's man/woman romantic relationships.

In my original post I indicate that I asked her if being called those names bugs her. To go deeper into it, my questioning was actually two-fold:

1. Is it that she doesn't like the specific terms I'm using; for example, is "Sugar" and "Honey" acceptable but "Baby" or "Sweetie" not acceptable, etc.

2. Or rather, is the issue that she dislikes being called any sort of nickname.

She couldn't have been more clear. She told me that she does NOT have a dislike of being called these names. Which later turned out to be very true. Even though she preferred to be called by her name, this preference was motivated by really really liking hearing her name said, not out of a dislike for the nicknames.

She didn't know whether or not to harbor a dislike of these names. Literally DID NOT KNOW. Her mind wasn't made up on the issue and wouldn't be until she understood the practice, and got to know me, a bit better.

Over time she got to witness me in various social settings. She learned that I treat her with the utmost respect (in all ways, especially in ways more important than nicknames) and that I treat everyone with all due respect.

She witnessed how, in the context of this utmost respect I showed to people, that I'm throwing out an awful lot of: dude, bro, brother-man, sis, man, rock-star, yo, miss, ma'am, sir, slick, sugar, my-man, money, cuddles, etc etc etc.

As I say in my original post, "She witnessed my massive propensity for calling everyone some sort of nickname, and she got to see in their responses that there was never a shred of disrespect in this habit of mine."

What she learned is that, in american culture, my nickname habit did not offend people. She learned that, in the way I lay it down, people genuinely like it. She made her own judgement that I treat others like this, and they are entertained, charmed, tickled, or at a minimum, not offended.

Also, in the early stage of a relationship, you're both learning about each other. She wasn't sure if I was the type to be casually disrespectful and then expect a girlfriend to just accept it.

Over time what she learned is that I treat her quite consistently with the utmost deference, respect and consideration in all the ways that are far more important than a nickname. Therefor the fact that I use a nickname is in that context of utmost respect, and that the nickname is not a contradiction to nor a violation of that respect.

Its out of that context of respect that the nicknames come, and people who meet me in person can sense that. I don't blindly, blithely and randomly pick any nickname that pops into my head. Its fitting to the person and the situation. Its a way for me to show that I'm really tuned in to the person, in a way that allows me to go outside of their "proper" title and name into an alternative title and name that is both complimentary and complementary.

dogsbody70 - you ask why I don't just call her by her name. In my original post, I say that's what I did when she requested it. But as we got to know each other better, I could sense an easing of formalities... especially after being intimate. We've been about as intimate as two people can be. I mean, we've gone beyond the pale in exploring intimacy.

So no, its not "sheer habit." As I said before, its not something I do out of mindless habit. Its really to raise the status of the relationship, to show respect and thoughtfulness and engagement and with a sense of humor and fun. If Saori hadn't seen this and come to these conclusions herself, she would NOT have eventually warmed up to the practice.

MMM - The point of the FB chat story and the word sempai was to demonstrate that I understood that the term is one of honor. To an american it is notable that someone who would in all respects seem to be a peer, a complete equal, would use a term of respect simply because the other person is one year older.

As for bijin, I had no idea if the word would be used by japanese speakers as a nickname or address in the way an american would say "Hey, Beautiful" as a way to address a woman.

But I did say in my original post that I picked that up from a girlfriend who was born and raised in Hiroshima. She liked it so much that I referred to her as "Bijin" that I called her that more than her real name.

Its one of the terms my current girlfriend kinda likes now. But I could sense what you told me, that the word bijin, while translating to roughly the equivalent of the english "beautiful" doesn't necessarily get used that way in Japan.

I care for and respect her deeply, so I'd never want to force her to change. I don't know where in my post I indicate that I am trying to force her to accept my nickname habit. Maybe the closest I come is towards the end when I say here's where we're at now:

"But occasionally "Honey" or "Bijin" slips out and she's fine with it."

I guess I could see that looking like I accidentally fall back on a habit, and she just bears it instead of reacting to it. In reality, she is coyly starting to prefer that I cut her in on this deal. I do it with everyone else, and now, she feels a bit on the outs if I'm not doing with her.

Maybe she doesn't want the formality she witnessed between her parents growing up. Her parents didn't have the best relationship. Slept in different rooms, etc. Maybe she's now relating that formality with limited intimacy.

She doesn't want limited intimacy. She wants the intimacy to go as deep as it can.

But like I said, with a long post like that, I understand how a quick browsing of it can present an incorrect impression.

Which brings me here.

"Oldtimer" Chiuchimu has been a member here exactly a month. And please, call your gal "omae". She will surely be impressed.

I know you didn't come here do be judged, but this is a forum. People ask questions, and give opinions. If several people think you are taking the wrong approach, it might be worth considering their opinions.

But lets not underestimate my girlfriend's ability to stand up for herself and not subject her life to a boyfriend who fails to show her proper respect.

You are calling her nicknames when she wants to be called by her given name. That's how you described it. In my head, that's not respecting her wishes.

I always treat everyone with the most respect that I can.

Then call her by the name she wishes you to address her as.

MMM - The point of the FB chat story and the word sempai was to demonstrate that I understood that the term is one of honor. To an american it is notable that someone who would in all respects seem to be a peer, a complete equal, would use a term of respect simply because the other person is one year older.

But they are not in all respects a peer, or a complete equal. They are from different grades and are different ages. It is black and white.

As for bijin, I had no idea if the word would be used by japanese speakers as a nickname or address in the way an american would say "Hey, Beautiful" as a way to address a woman.

Nope. Never. It would be like saying "Hey, attractive woman!"

No need to read previous post, still need help please!
 

OK I'm just doing this for a bit of clarity, that is, breaking up into two posts. Anyone still willing to help me out, please skip the above post and lets continue a conversation about nicknames in the context of a romantic relationship. Here's the main points to get from the above:

1. I'm 46 years old, american gaijin, just started dating a 37 year old japanese lady.

2. Initially she wasn't too sure how she felt about lovey-dovey nicknames (Honey, Sugar, Sweetie, etc) but she's starting to sorta like the idea the more we get used to each other.

3. I'm trying to understand her cultural background in this respect (i.e., her parents never used cutesy nicknames, were more formal, and only used each others' actual names).

4. The reason I'm posting, I'm hoping to get ideas for japanese terms of endearment, romantic petnames and nicknames, etc.

5. If such a practice is rare or unheard of in the context of native japanese culture, then what's the best I can do to use japanese words in the way that americans use certain words to address a romantic interest?

Regarding the advice given by chiuchimu, I recognize that a couple of those terms relay respect, i.e., [lastname]san. That's the sort of thing I'm actually kind of interested in.

So Saori's friend, one year younger, called her Sempai. I'm 9 years older than Saori, would it be fitting for me to call her Sempai? Or is that just between women or only referring to the older age, etc.

I want her to feel like I'm putting her on a pedastal; that I respect her as an equal/superior.

But I also want the nickname to convey warmth, romance, intimacy, familiarity.

I want to blend the two concepts. Any clever ideas for japanese word mashups?

Bear in mind, she will be tolerant of an idea that's not perfectly correct japanese usage. For example, how a previous japanese girlfriend LOVED IT that I called her "Bijin" as if it were her real first name.

Like if I put the suffix -san after the japanese word for sugar... It may sound horrible and make no sense if said to a japanese person in Japan.

But coming from me, maybe Saori would see past the incorrectness and think its cute, funny and acceptable. Or maybe she'll think its whack.

So Saori's friend, one year younger, called her Sempai. I'm 9 years older than Saori, would it be fitting for me to call her Sempai? Or is that just between women or only referring to the older age, etc.

Never. She would be calling you "sempai" if you went to the same school.

3. I'm trying to understand her cultural background in this respect (i.e., her parents never used cutesy nicknames, were more formal, and only used each others' actual names).

Is this abnormal? My parents have never called me by anything but the name they gave me.

4. The reason I'm posting, I'm hoping to get ideas for japanese terms of endearment, romantic petnames and nicknames, etc.

5. If such a practice is rare or unheard of in the context of native japanese culture, then what's the best I can do to use japanese words in the way that americans use certain words to address a romantic interest?

They are not used in the same way as some couples use them in the US. It is really a personal decision between the couple.

I want her to feel like I'm putting her on a pedastal; that I respect her as an equal/superior.

How is putting her on a pedestal making her an equal? Take her off the pedestal.

Actually, I'm not. Never did that to her. That's not how I described it. As she witnessed how other americans respond to my nicknames, I could tell that she could tell that there was no offense on the part of others, and no disrespect on my part. I could tell that she would probably be open to me restarting a practice she had previously put the kabash on.

Maybe I'm being a bit cautious and timid on this point. She's not just kinda-sorta open to it because I persist in doing it regardless. When she said "Don't," I didn't. But as our relationship progressed and intimacy increased I could, correctly, perceive a shift in her understanding of my nickname habit.

She's actually appreciating it. I think she relates her acceptance of this practice as part of a two-fold process: 1) becoming more 'americanized'; 2) being more accepted into my life. She sees me doing with everyone else I know, she's kinda left out if I don't do it with her.

She's learning that, in american culture, lack of formality does NOT equate to a lack of respect. Quite to the contrary. In my case, she sees quite clearly that the more I like - or love - someone, the more they get nicknames, good natured teasing, etc; the more I know/love someone, the less formal I am.

And she's seen the flip side. I try to get along with everyone, but you know how in real life there can be conflict, tension; people you don't get along with, or don't want to be close to. In these situations she sees that I don't use the nicknames, I'm much more formal.

So while growing up, she saw her parents' persistence in formality equated to continued respect; and figured a lack of formality was lack of respect. I think she actually felt it on a gut level more than as an intellectual analysis.

Now she's seeing in my behavior that an increased level of intimacy equates to a decrease in formality; and vice versa, an increase in formality is a sign of not getting along.

I wouldn't be here asking for suggestions for nicknames if I wasn't 100% certain that its exactly what she wants.

In any case, MMM, thanks for hanging in with me and continuing to help me out.

Regarding what you say about Sempai in the FB chat. That its black and white, they are not peers, there's that one year age difference. That is just such an odd concept for any american to get their mind around. For us, when you're much younger, a year can be a somewhat significant difference.

But to our minds, by the time two people are 36/37, that difference would seem to melt away, and would consider themselves close enough to be considered virtually perfectly equal peers.

I wish you well Djubb.



the written word can so easily be misinterpreted--no tone of voice, etc etc.

Maybe if you find a special word of endearment-- solely for this young lady-- many relationships have their own private expressions for each other.


I have a japanese lady friend-- I still struggle with her secretiveness and reluctance to show any feelings at all.

I am female-- so is she----------we are both good friends-- but I doubt I will ever know her.


Anyway I wish you well-- You have been very open and honest-- and NO-- I should not judge you at all.

Its obvious that you do Care about your young lady--

Thanks for all your kind words. Regarding the above quote, I had gotten to that point with the previous girlfriend who was from Japan. As I said, through conversations about word meanings I picked up the word "bijin" and took to calling her that. Although that does not seem to work, linguistically, in Japan, that girlfriend simply loved it.

I'm sure Saori and I will find something that she likes. Its fun for her when I surprise her about knowledge of things japanese that would usually be obscure to your typical american.

Like just that I knew the words gaijin and okonomyaki. That's why it would be fun for us if I approached her with some ideas. It kinda takes the charm out of things when I go to her and say, OK, what's the cute nickname you want me to call you?

She would likely be a bit coy or modest to suggest something that really compliments her. That's why its better for me to come up with it.

So here I am.

You just don't call your girl "sugar" or "honey" or whatever common noun in general in Japan. Of course, everybody has their own taste, so some Japanese girls may love to be called Bijin, especially in English in which case they know that the cultural norm is different, but usually it sounds pretty shallow and frivolous in Japan.

I'm not at all a lady's man, but I'm Japanese and have gone out with like a half dozen Japanese girls, and for all of them, I came up with some nicknames out of their own names, for example if she was Saori, I'd call her like Sao-chan, Sao, Sah-chan, etc, I'd even use their last name to compose something that sounds good but I don't just go for the name of something that is physically sweet. Sugar and honey are sweet, yeah, but that's too direct. There are a lot of nicknames for girls in famous Japanese classic literatures like Genji Stories from 11th century and a lot of them are like flowers and stuff, so I guess I can pull it off if I'm really smart and able to present myself a really intelligent man, but I can't be spending THAT much effort coming up with girls' nicknames so I just stick with just modifying their real names.

Anyway, I'm very cautious about using "Omae", though I use it quite a lot depending on the situation. It shows a bit of dominance, or strong intimacy, which is good when used properly but it can be taken as arrogance if you don't know what you are doing.

First date, first week, first month, whatever. I'd still be cocking an eyebrow and saying to my friends "Nice guy and I like him but he calls me 'sugar' and 'baby' all the time. What the hell?" And that was my point. Me, as a Non-Japanese person, would be doing the exact same things your girl is doing; figuring out the precise whys and wherefores of this behavior I find odd. I would definitely be asking if it's what you did with an ex-girlfriend because I might like to point out that i don't like my likes being lumped into a general 'what girls like' category. Maybe your ex liked it. Good for her. But I'm an individual, and I'm not so sure, so it's kind of off to assume I'll like it right off the bat.

Or, honestly, none of my boyfriends have ever used pet names, so no, i wouldn't know quite how to take it if a guy did. I wouldn't 'know what to read into it' either. Like, whoa, what is this? What does he think of me? Don't forget, your girlfriend is older than me too; if she's never come across it before, she might feel odd using pet-names in what's sometimes seen as a lovey sort of teenage way.

I'm not saying it's a horrible thing to want to use a pet name, and if she's warming to the idea, no harm in trying, but maybe pick something more personal to her.

There are stereotypes of the big American guy sleazing around picking up young japanese girls and being all 'Hey baaaaby, hows it going Sugarrr~*slurp*" too so maybe ease off the 'you're sweet and pretty' pick-up-line style affections and go for something with a touch more depth and dignity.

36/37 doesn't make much difference if they met at that age (but it still makes a little) but she will always be a year older than her classmate from school, and that will never change. It's not odd for "any American" to get his head around, only ones not familiar with Japan.

If I misread her desires in the process, that is my mistake. I would suggest calling her Sa-chan.