BRANCH: Anime/Manga piracy discussion

[WingsToDiscovery]

I'm not the one who's sensitive. We're in here talking about US companies going bankrupt, and the state of Korea and the US. All I did was show that hey, the anime industry really isn't that healthy in NA. Then you go flying off the handle as if I was even acting like the US was everything; It's unfortunate that there are still people like yourself who suffer from Napoleonic Syndrome. It does nobody any good.

The only reason why I included that data about the 5% is because you tried to bully me into feeling like my counrty is irrelevant. You started it first, not me, but it's a shame that in your mind you'll never admit this. Saying things like "the US doesn't matter!" is utterly stupid, no matter where you're from, so I corrected you. If we produce almost half of the world's economic output, who do you think is doing the buying and selling? US....that was coincidental

Lastly, would you care to show me imperical data to suggest that Europe as a whole (or individually) is such a large leading player in anime? You've done nothing but set up a straw man argument, asking me to try and prove myself right. Well how about you prove me wrong? If you can find something, I'd be genuinly interested, because it's always nice to learn something new. I've been sifting through data and I can't find anything that ever includes Europe, or when it does I can never find a breakdown of individual countries. Or don't provide any information, because then I can just be like you and say "I don't care! It's not the US so it doesn't mean anything! Europe is not the center of the world!" lolz.

[WingsToDiscovery]

Originally Posted by MissMisa

Englands largest anime convention (that's purely anime, so this doesn't include the London Expo) get's around 1200 people.

I knew we had conventions in the US, like the Anime Expo in California, but I had no clue just how many dozens of other ones there were until I looked it up depending on the region (I said earlier I'm not into anime/manga). Is there a big difference between anime/cosplay conventions? What is the largest anime convention in England?

[MMM]

Originally Posted by WingsToDiscovery

You've eluded the question, though. If any price is too high for a thief, then why do we continue to have consumers who do both? In this case, I think you're implying it. By this logic, if 0.00 was the determining factor, then we'd have zero consumers.

But I am not saying everyone is a thief. Only the thieves are. It doesn't take everyone stealing to put a store out of business, only a certain percentage.

What question am I eluding?

Originally Posted by WingsToDiscovery

You have to look at when the average consumer is going to be turned onto pirating, not the thief who is already going to steal. People are going to steal regardless, whether it's anime, cars, jewelry, whatever, even when they know it's wrong. You can't form an argument around people who you already know are going to act a certain way; rather, it's more important to find out at what point the consumer is going to find an alternative means of entertainment.

The average consumer will be never be turned onto pirating or stealing as long as they know that it is illegal.

Many teenagers want cars, but can't afford to buy them. What percentage of teenagers go out and actually steal a car. I am going to guess it is well under 1% of teens. So I think your argument that "people are going to steal regardless" is an empty one. If people truly understand it is wrong, the vast majority will not engage in criminal behavior to fulfill their needs.

[Kururugi]

Originally Posted by MMM

Many teenagers want cars, but can't afford to buy them. What percentage of teenagers go out and actually steal a car. I am going to guess it is well under 1% of teens. So I think your argument that "people are going to steal regardless" is an empty one. If people truly understand it is wrong, the vast majority will not engage in criminal behavior to fulfill their needs.

When 3D printers are more advanced and "purchasing" a car is just a matter of downloading (legally or illegally) the blueprints and printing out the parts, I suspect a number of people will be stealing cars.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Kururugi

When 3D printers are more advanced and "purchasing" a car is just a matter of downloading (legally or illegally) the blueprints and printing out the parts, I suspect a number of people will be stealing cars.

Let me know when that day happens.

Until then, the idea that Wingsto Discovery is saying, that at a certain point everyone will break the law to get what they want is woefully disproven.

[Maylar]

Just wanted to put my thoughts in on this. As somebody that enjoys watching anime in the United States, I do feel that people that steal anime/manga are in the wrong. However I know most people don't steal. One of the problems I see in the United States is the cost of Anime is more costly than other types of entertainment in the same vein. I'll list some examples.

.Hack//SIGN
Amazon.com: Hack//Sign - Anime Legends Complete Collection: Mitsuki Saiga, Megumi Toyoguchi, Kazuhiro Nakata, Akiko…
If I wanted to purchase the complete //SIGN set, I can be expected on Amazon to pay around $50 (after shipping) for the season.

The Universe (Blu-Ray)
Amazon.com: The Universe Seasons 1-3 [Blu-ray]: Universe, Douglas J. Cohen;Luke Ellis: Movies & TV
This is a series based on the Universe and our understanding of it. It'll run me about $80, contains three entire seasons AND it's on Blu-Ray. See the value difference here?

Now obviously this is just one example, but many of us just see better value monetary wise in non-anime dvds. I can remember when //SIGN was over $150. I love anime, so I purchase it... it's just for the most part, I have to budget for my anime more so than I do other forms of Entertainment. I also wish I could get blu-ray more often for anime... but anytime I go to the anime section in stores, it is almost always in standard DVD. This sucks for those of us with higher definition televisions.

I suppose in the end, I just wish I had more of a selection of titles to choose from, and that they were competitively priced. Anybody that thinks that they should get it for free is foolish. But I do want to feel like I'm not paying through the nose for it either when compared to other dvd purchases.

[Koir]

Originally Posted by MMM

But I am not saying everyone is a thief. Only the thieves are.

Um...what? That's some impressive circular logic there...

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Koir

Um...what? That's some impressive circular logic there...

I am not sure where the confusion is. Not everyone steals anime and manga online (although those that do would like you to believe that).

[Koir]

Originally Posted by MMM

I am not sure where the confusion is. Not everyone steals anime and manga online (although those that do would like you to believe that).

I meant that in two sentences you said "Thieves are thieves."...which is kinda redundant, taken on its own.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Koir

I meant that in two sentences you said "Thieves are thieves."...which is kinda redundant, taken on its own.

I guess out of context it may look a little odd.