Please help me to read this English sentence:

[Columbine]

Originally Posted by YuriTokoro

What’s “black English tea”? My dictionary says “black tea” is a kind of Chinese teas.
Do you say “English tea” “red tea”?

Is this Japanese perceived notion? English tea comes with Western food, green tea comes with Japanese food, and Chinese black tea comes with Chinese food.
So, when they gave me green tea with western food, I felt it very odd.


Did the Japanese person get it funny too?


How about other cake in the picture? Have you had like them?
I’ve heard, in the US, they don’t sell cut cakes. They usually sell whole cakes.
Which do they sell in your country? Whole or cut? I’ve been in England twice, but I’ve never seen English confectionery.

Collin explained what i mean black tea is already, however, in England we call a kind of tea from South Africa 'red tea', so to me, Green Tea seems very asian and I think of jasmine tea when I am offered 'chinese tea'.

I would find it odd to be served green tea with english food too, just as it would seem odd to you to be offered milk tea with sushi. But on a flight, it's a bit different isn't it? You get tea offered by itself, and anyway, both types of cuisine are usually available. I don't know if the japanese passengers were given the same types of tea I was, as I wasn't sat near enough to see.

Is that a mont blanc on top of a cake? How interesting! I've never seen that before. In the UK you can buy just a slice of cake if you go to a proper bakery, tea room or patisserie, but mostly in supermarkets they just sell the whole cake. I prefer to bake it myself though
A lot of the very traditional cakes (like christmas cake) aren't baked at all; they're boiled or steamed and are more like a cake-y dumpling. Its also quite common to find cake that's been cooked as a tray-bake so it comes in squares, not slices.

[Koir]

Originally Posted by YuriTokoro

Hi, Koir.
A reason of the confusion is that many Japanese people somehow believe “tea” is “English tea”, and Japanese tea is always said “green tea”.
You also have preconceptions about the meaning of tea? What are your preconceptions?

The first few readings I was thinking "Well, it's all tea. What's the conflict?" Then I started understanding in that situation the flight attendant and you had different ideas of the kind of tea you wanted to order and my understanding improved.

I didn’t know Canadian people call “French Fries” “chips”.
So, in Canada, sliced and fried thin potato is “potato chips”, and “French fries” is “chips”?
We say “French fries” “Fried Potato” here.

Essentially, yes. Though lately I have been referring to them as French fries mainly because that is how they are written in restaurant menus. I was a lot younger when the miscommunications happened during the U.S. visit.

I think you may have chances to watch American TV programs. Do you? If the people in the TV programs say “French fries”, do you feel it’s odd or unfamiliar?

I do watch American programs on TV once in a while in the rare times I watch television. Unfortunately, the characters are often not in a restaurant setting and ordering from a menu.

Please tell me.
What do you say the vegetables behind the meat in the picture below? Are they “garnish”?

I would call the parsley (green leafy sprig) garnish as that's not strictly needed to enjoy the steak entree. The vegetables I would consider a "side dish" that adds to the visual appeal of the meal and give you something other than the steak to taste.

‘After I would say "Tea, please", the flight attendant would reply, “Green or English?”’
This sentence sounds like this happened several times, but it happened only once when I got to know that “tea” also means “green tea” and that I should have said “English tea”.
Can “would” mean “it happened only once”?

That was my error. If it happened only once, using the past form for completed action, and your original description is correct.

Thanks!
Still! I wish I could have a chat with you in Japanese!!

Maybe one day, Yuri.

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by ColinHowell

By "black English tea", Columbine means Western "black tea". (Since the English popularized tea drinking in the West, it has become strongly associated with them.) Black tea is made from the same kind of tea leaves as what the Chinese call "red tea", but the Western drink tends to be stronger, and unlike Chinese red tea, Western black tea is usually not drunk straight. In Britain it is usually drunk with milk and sugar; in America it's more often drunk with lemon and either sugar or honey.

Hi, ColinHowell. I’m sorry; I’m very slow to answer.
So, English popularized tea is “black tea”, and Chinese tea is “red tea”. Is this right?
Somehow the internet dictionary said “black tea” is Chinese tea, but that must have been a mistake.
I drink “black tea”, and I don’t add milk or sugar in it.
That reminds me that flight attendants don’t understand when I say “plane tea, please”, although my English teacher has taught me the expression (meaning “without milk or sugar).
They don’t believe strongly that you always add something in your tea, do they?

By the way, while Western black tea may have originated in China, a lot of it is grown in India. (During the 19th century, the British managed to smuggle tea plants out of China and cultivate them in India, breaking their former dependence on China for tea supplies.)

This reminds me, India was controlled by England.

I don't think that notion is unique to Japan at all. I too would find it odd to be served either green tea or Chinese tea with Western food.

Thank you very much!

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by Columbine

Collin explained what i mean black tea is already, however, in England we call a kind of tea from South Africa 'red tea', so to me, Green Tea seems very asian and I think of jasmine tea when I am offered 'chinese tea'.

Hi, Columbine.
I see. You have black tea and red tea. Red one is from South Africa.
Thank you!

I would find it odd to be served green tea with english food too, just as it would seem odd to you to be offered milk tea with sushi. But on a flight, it's a bit different isn't it? You get tea offered by itself, and anyway, both types of cuisine are usually available. I don't know if the japanese passengers were given the same types of tea I was, as I wasn't sat near enough to see.

When I fly by an American airline, they serve western food. And they give me green tea when I say “tea”. I haven’t said “green tea”.
I thought that they must have believed Japanese people would always like to drink green tea.

Is that a mont blanc on top of a cake? How interesting! I've never seen that before. In the UK you can buy just a slice of cake if you go to a proper bakery, tea room or patisserie, but mostly in supermarkets they just sell the whole cake.

Yes, that’s sweet chestnut paste.
I see. Some patisseries sell sliced pieces of cake, while supermarkets sell the whole ones.

I prefer to bake it myself though

That’s cool!
What do you bake?

A lot of the very traditional cakes (like christmas cake) aren't baked at all; they're boiled or steamed and are more like a cake-y dumpling. Its also quite common to find cake that's been cooked as a tray-bake so it comes in squares, not slices.

I’m sorry. I can’t imagine any steamed cake in England. I only think of Japanese manjyuu…

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by Koir

Essentially, yes. Though lately I have been referring to them as French fries mainly because that is how they are written in restaurant menus. I was a lot younger when the miscommunications happened during the U.S. visit.

In Canada, restaurant menus say “chips”?
In most cases in Japan, you don’t have lots of choices. Side dishes are set.
You don’t need to say about your side dish here, except in McDonalds or that kind of restaurants.

I would call the parsley (green leafy sprig) garnish as that's not strictly needed to enjoy the steak entree. The vegetables I would consider a "side dish" that adds to the visual appeal of the meal and give you something other than the steak to taste.

The parsley is “garnish”, and the potato and carrot and corn is “side dish”, right？

That was my error. If it happened only once, using the past form for completed action, and your original description is correct.

Thanks!

Maybe one day, Yuri.

You promise?

[Koir]

Originally Posted by YuriTokoro

In Canada, restaurant menus say “chips”?
In most cases in Japan, you don’t have lots of choices. Side dishes are set.
You don’t need to say about your side dish here, except in McDonalds or that kind of restaurants.

The menus say "French fries", so I changed my ordering habits to reflect that. But usually I just say "fries".

The parsley is “garnish”, and the potato and carrot and corn is “side dish”, right？

Correct, Yuri.

You promise?

*chuckles* I suppose I did. Well, now I have even more incentive to actually start, for however long it may take for me to not sound like a Canadian who has learned some Japanese at an old age

[YuriTokoro]

Hi.

Could you correct my English?


"Trip to Okinawa last week"

This is my first time visiting Okinawa where is the southernmost prefecture of Japan. The area is very famous for its delicious food and distinctive culture.
I went there to listen to Okinawa folk songs live performances. Okinawa songs are popular, and a lot of CDs of them are on sale. I myself have many. You might have heard “Hana” or “Shima Uta”.
So these songs are very cool that I thought most Okinawa people love and sing their songs. However, it turned out that the folk songs were sung only in restraints on the main street for tourists. Most young Okinawa people seemed to prefer hit tunes there.
I knew most young Japanese prefer hit songs, again in Okinawa, the state seems to be the same.
Years ago, when I planned to go to Ireland, one of my English teachers who was from the country asked why I wanted to go her home town. I said that was to listen to Irish music live performances, but she replied, “They are boring.”
I used to learn Japanese folk songs singing and Japanese classical dancing, but quit them because few young people played them. I don’t listen or dance them at all now.
Do you love playing your traditional music or dancing? How about your friends?

Thank you!

Okinawa Prefecture - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

YouTube - はいさいおじさん -沖縄民謡-エイサーショー2Haisai Ojisan -Okinawa Folk Song Minyo

[Koir]

Originally Posted by YuriTokoro

Hi.

Could you correct my English?


"Trip to Okinawa Last Week"

This was my first time visiting Okinawa, which is the southernmost prefecture of Japan. The area is very famous for its delicious food and distinctive culture.
I went there to listen to Okinawan folk songs performed live. Okinawan songs are popular and available on a lot of CDs. I myself have quite a few. You might have heard of “Hana” or “Shima Uta”.
Since I believe these songs are very cool, I thought most Okinawan people would love to sing their songs. However, it turned out that the folk songs were sung only in restaurants or on the street for tourists. Most young Okinawa people seemed to prefer hit tunes there instead.
I knew most young Japanese prefer hit songs, and in Okinawa it appears no different.
Years ago, when I planned to go to Ireland, I was asked one of my English teachers from there why I wanted to go her hometown. I said that was to listen to Irish music performed live. Surprisingly, she replied that “They are boring.”
I used to learn Japanese folk singing and Japanese classical dancing, but quit because few other young people did so. I don’t listen or dance them at all now.
Do you love playing your traditional music or dancing? How about your friends?

Thank you!

Okinawa Prefecture - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

YouTube - はいさいおじさん -沖縄民謡-エイサーショー2Haisai Ojisan -Okinawa Folk Song Minyo

Quite an informative post, Yuri. It's interesting to see how aspects of culture other people find exotic are just everyday occurances to those living the culture, only done for tourism reasons. I tend to place some of the blame on how small the globe has become due to the internet and other easy ways of communicating for people preferring whatever new "music" comes out. Myself, I find that the music I listen to is old enough to graduate from high school. Right now, I'm listening to songs from an album released in 1997!

On to the revisions:

"So these songs are very cool that I thought most Okinawa people love and sing their songs."

was changed to

"Since I believe these songs are very cool, I thought most Okinawan people would love to sing their songs."

This was done to create a framework of your preconceptions in order to contrast them with Okinawan individuals' opinions in the rest of the paragraph.

"I knew most young Japanese prefer hit songs, again in Okinawa, the state seems to be the same."

was changed to

"I knew most young Japanese prefer hit songs, and in Okinawa it appears no different."

This was done, again, to illustrate your preconceptions based on knowledge of young Japanese people's music preferences. In this case, your preconceptions proved correct in showing music preferences of young Okinawan people. I'm surmising you are comparing young people's preferences between areas, though if that is not the case, the sentence still functions well as revised.

Also, the above revision is somewhat of an English saying to my thinking. "Appears no different" can be seen as somewhat difficult to understand as written, but it carries the same meaning that two or more things are identical when examined under certain criteria.

"Years ago, when I planned to go to Ireland, I was asked one of my English teachers from there why I wanted to go her hometown."

The bolded revision was done to streamline the readability of the sentence while still referring clearly back to the English teacher's country of origin.

Also, the revision in the sentence explaining your reasons for not continue traditional singing and dancing was done for the same reason. "Few other young people did so" both reference the group you identify with and the activities explained earlier in the sentence.

My family doesn't have any traditional dances, and little traditional songs beyond Christian songs. Personally though, I have many Canadian singing groups I listen to frequently, and I suppose they could be called my traditional songs. I don't sing myself as I don't have that good a singing voice.

Hope this will be of use, Yuri!

[YuriTokoro]

Originally Posted by Koir

Quite an informative post, Yuri. It's interesting to see how aspects of culture other people find exotic are just everyday occurances to those living the culture, only done for tourism reasons. I tend to place some of the blame on how small the globe has become due to the internet and other easy ways of communicating for people preferring whatever new "music" comes out. Myself, I find that the music I listen to is old enough to graduate from high school. Right now, I'm listening to songs from an album released in 1997!

Koir, hi. Thanks as always.

Sorry, I don’t understand this : “Myself, I find that the music I listen to is old enough to graduate from high school.”
The music is old enough to graduate from high school?
Do you mean that the music was first released about 18 years ago?

On to the revisions:

"So these songs are very cool that I thought most Okinawa people love and sing their songs."

was changed to

"Since I believe these songs are very cool, I thought most Okinawan people would love to sing their songs."

This was done to create a framework of your preconceptions in order to contrast them with Okinawan individuals' opinions in the rest of the paragraph.

I see.
Is this sentence correct in grammar?
“Since I’m very busy dancing every day, I have no time to do housework.”

By the way, I’ve never heard the way of saying “Okinawan”.
I live in Kanagawa prefecture. So, I’m “Kanagawan” !! Is this right??

"I knew most young Japanese prefer hit songs, again in Okinawa, the state seems to be the same."

was changed to

"I knew most young Japanese prefer hit songs, and in Okinawa it appears no different."

This was done, again, to illustrate your preconceptions based on knowledge of young Japanese people's music preferences. In this case, your preconceptions proved correct in showing music preferences of young Okinawan people. I'm surmising you are comparing young people's preferences between areas, though if that is not the case, the sentence still functions well as revised.

“This was done, again, to illustrate your preconceptions based on knowledge of young Japanese people's music preferences.” ???
There might be some misunderstandings.
I thought that young Okinawan people would like singing their folk songs before I went there, but it turned out that most young Okinawan people seemed to prefer hit tunes than their traditional songs.

I think this misunderstanding might be from the word “folk songs”. In Japanese I would say it “minyou”, and they don’t become a hit nowadays. (And yet, an Okinawan song became a hit several years ago.) Most minyou songs are very old. And, Okinawan minyou is not like Japansese minyou, because that prefecture was “the Ryukyu Kingdom” till 1871.
Should I write this in my composition?


Wikipedia says : Min'yō (民謡) is a genre of traditional Japanese music. The term is a translation of the German word "Volkslied"[1] (folk song) and has only been in use during the twentieth century. Japanese traditional designations referring to more or less the same genre include "inaka bushi" ("country song") "inaka buri" ("country tune"), "hina uta" ("rural song") and the like, but for most of the people who sang such songs they were simply "uta" (song). Many min'yō are connected to forms of work or to specific trades and were originally sung between work or for specific jobs. Other min'yō function simply as entertainment, as dance accompaniment, or as a components of religious rituals.

When you look up the word “minyou” in dictionary, you would find it “folk song”. So I wrote “folk songs”. However, I should have written “country song” or “country tune” instead.

I wanted to listen Okinawan music. They only played them in a few restaurants, I didn't know it.
I entered a wrong restaurant, and they played “not Okinawan music” there. I was really disappointed.

Also, the above revision is somewhat of an English saying to my thinking. "Appears no different" can be seen as somewhat difficult to understand as written, but it carries the same meaning that two or more things are identical when examined under certain criteria.

I see. “Appears no different” means “two or more things are identical”.
“Appears identical” is less common. OK.

"Years ago, when I planned to go to Ireland, I was asked one of my English teachers from there why I wanted to go her hometown."

The bolded revision was done to streamline the readability of the sentence while still referring clearly back to the English teacher's country of origin.

“my English teachers who was from the country” should be “my English teacher from there”. OK!

Also, the revision in the sentence explaining your reasons for not continue traditional singing and dancing was done for the same reason. "Few other young people did so" both reference the group you identify with and the activities explained earlier in the sentence.

“few young people played them” should be “few other young people did so.”.
I always forget “other”.

My family doesn't have any traditional dances, and little traditional songs beyond Christian songs. Personally though, I have many Canadian singing groups I listen to frequently, and I suppose they could be called my traditional songs. I don't sing myself as I don't have that good a singing voice.

I’m sure that one of the greatest singers is Janis Joplin,(actually, she died many years ago) and her voice was not that good. So, you must be a soulful singer!


“However, it turned out that the folk songs were sung only in restaurants or on the street for tourists.”
Can I change this sentence to this?
“However, it turned out that the folk songs were sung only in restaurants on Kokusai Street, the most popular street in Okinawa, for tourists.”

Koir, thanks as always!!

[Koir]

Originally Posted by YuriTokoro

Koir, hi. Thanks as always.

Sorry, I don’t understand this : “Myself, I find that the music I listen to is old enough to graduate from high school.”
The music is old enough to graduate from high school?
Do you mean that the music was first released about 18 years ago?

That's exactly right, Yuri.

I see.
Is this sentence correct in grammar?
“Since I’m very busy dancing every day, I have no time to do housework.”

The sentence is correct. If you don't mind me asking, is that your situation?

By the way, I’ve never heard the way of saying “Okinawan”.
I live in Kanagawa prefecture. So, I’m “Kanagawan” !! Is this right??

That is correct in situations where your location is important to the discussion (such as where to vote, or in competitions with other prefectures). In other situations, referring to yourself as a resident of the country (Japanese) is correct.

“This was done, again, to illustrate your preconceptions based on knowledge of young Japanese people's music preferences.” ???
There might be some misunderstandings.
I thought that young Okinawan people would like singing their folk songs before I went there, but it turned out that most young Okinawan people seemed to prefer hit tunes than their traditional songs.

I phrased it that way to make it identical to the previous revision explanation. In that case, the preconception was incorrect and you gained knowledge. Believing that young Okinawan people have the same preference in music as young Japanese people was the preconception you had, and it was proven correct.

I think this misunderstanding might be from the word “folk songs”. In Japanese I would say it “minyou”, and they don’t become a hit nowadays. (And yet, an Okinawan song became a hit several years ago.) Most minyou songs are very old. And, Okinawan minyou is not like Japansese minyou, because that prefecture was “the Ryukyu Kingdom” till 1871.
Should I write this in my composition?

Probably, as it can show that songs from a music genre that is mostly unpopular right now can become hit songs that young people will listen to. The subtext being that young people who do like these hit folk songs may investigate further and find they like other folk songs that don't become hits in popular music.

When you look up the word “minyou” in dictionary, you would find it “folk song”. So I wrote “folk songs”. However, I should have written “country song” or “country tune” instead.

Describing it that way may reduce confusion for readers unfamiliar with the term "folk songs", so it's a good idea.

I wanted to listen Okinawan music. They only played them in a few restaurants, I didn't know it.

I entered a wrong restaurant, and they played “not Okinawan music” there. I was really disappointed.

Well, you'll know for the next time you travel there, Yuri. It's experience in more ways than one.

I’m sure that one of the greatest singers is Janis Joplin,(actually, she died many years ago) and her voice was not that good. So, you must be a soulful singer!

Thanks for the vote of confidence, Yuri.

“However, it turned out that the folk songs were sung only in restaurants or on the street for tourists.”
Can I change this sentence to this?
“However, it turned out that the folk songs were sung only in restaurants on Kokusai Street, the most popular street in Okinawa, for tourists.”

Absolutely. You travelled there, so it's natural to think you'd remember exact street names and the story behind them.

Koir, thanks as always!!

Just doing what I can.