Obama vs. McCain

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by noodle

Oh my good GOD... I really can't believe it! I really do need to spell everything out for you don't I? When I was talking about caring about what you have to say, it's in response to me getting defensive and taking things personally. SO; when I say I don't care about what you have to say, it means I don't care ENOUGH to take things personal or to get defensive!!! Geez, I've seen slow, but this is just ridiculous... I suggest you sort out your ego problem, and stop looking for shit becuase it's pretty sad; especially from a grown man!

Yeah... you sure proved that to me... by taking it personally and getting even MORE defensive.

Keep digging that hole you're digging.

[noodle]

Originally Posted by MMM

You are on the cusp of one of the potentially most important elections of America's lifetime. (I know, many Republicans don't think so.) But it has already been a history changing election season, and that was just the primaries.

Why would you hitch hike to Canada, when you are in the US for one of the most exciting election cycles EVER? It doesn't matter if you are old enough to vote or not. The person elected will affect your life. So you have two choices: be apathetic and ignore, or get interested and talk about it. You surely have friends who can vote. What do they think? Talk to your parents or other people. This is one of the things that is not only our right, but is our responsibility as people with the freedom to choose thier leader. Many people in the world aren't that lucky. It's easy to get spoiled, but we have already lost a lot of freedoms over the last 6 years, and I hope we don't lose more.

I think it's very hard to get young people interested in politics. First of all, you never really hear any of these senators actually talk TO the youth. There is also the problem of the youth not really knowing what is needed in life; so sometimes, it's better not to vote, than to vote just for the sake of it or to do the same as the parents just for the sake of it.

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

Yeah... you sure proved that to me... by taking it personally and getting even MORE defensive.

Keep digging that hole you're digging.

Awww, that's sweet of ya... Thanks for the advice, but unfortunately, there is a difference between getting annoying and taking things personally! When you see stupid comments, it's hard not to get frustrated; but then again, you wouldn't know

[MMM]

Originally Posted by DesiredMess

That is all true. I actually have been discussing the election a lot with friends and other people. It is truly a big deal, and that's why I'm feeling so overwhelmed. Knowing that I'm going to be out in the world on my own soon and having to worry about rent/gas/food/ect. has gotten me pretty stressed.

The bad part is, I don't find myself having much faith in either Obama or McCain. I'm not sure if they are just talking to get themselve in the white hourse, or if they are really concerned about the people of America. I've been trying to learn more and more though.

To be completely honest, I sort of wanted Hillary Clinton to be president. :/

To be honest, I am not jealous of you being 17 right now. There is a lot to think about...scary stuff. I did it once...don't need to do it again.

And you should be suspicious...of all candidates. That means you are thinking.

[Asakura]

Yeah I'm not too nuts about being 17 myself either. The day of the election is the day after my birthday.

I'm gonna be honest I want a president that will pull us out of this economic low. Pull a bunch of my friends out of this senseless war. Nationalize health care, among other things. I don't want to spend the first part of my adult life in an economic depression! I already had a hard time finding a job, and it dosen't pay very well to boot. I want to have my own buissness one day, but I don't want to do it in a time where my countrys economy is failing.

I want your honest opinon, who can do these things?

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Asakura

Yeah I'm not too nuts about being 17 myself either. The day of the election is the day after my birthday.

I'm gonna be honest I want a president that will pull us out of this economic low. Pull a bunch of my friends out of this senseless war. Nationalize health care, among other things. I don't want to spend the first part of my adult life in an economic depression! I already had a hard time finding a job, and it dosen't pay very well to boot. I want to have my own buissness one day, but I don't want to do it in a time where my countrys economy is failing.

I want your honest opinon, who can do these things?

My honest opinion is I don't know if anyone can do those things. Certainly not alone.

But if you are asking me with those desires who I would choose? I think you know the answer.

McCain himself has said the economy is not his strong suit. Of course, Obama is newer, but looking at both thier economic ideas, I like Obama's plan better.

Neither McCain or Obama will "nationalize" heath care, but I think Obama's ideas are more realistic and affordable.

In terms of getting our friends home from Iraq, I am sure you know that is much higher on Obama's list than McCain's.

Are you sure you can't register to vote? If the election is the day AFTER your birthday, you should still be able to register for the election in November. What state are you in?

[Asakura]

I live in Texas, you have to be registered 6 months before you can vote.

I know alot of what I said can't be done by one person. But c'mon the Executive Office is only 1/3 of our goverment. Why aren't these issues being adressed by the Goverment as a whole instead of being put on the shoulders of the President? Maby I worded that wrong...why aren't these issues being solved? I'm sure there being adressed but obviously theres a wrench in the system. I don't claim to know what that is but it seems like theres something wrong.

I'm not trying to bash the U.S. Goverment, but isn't their job to ensure the saftey, well being, and prosperity of this country? If it is, in my opinion the job isn't being done correctly. I'm a lower-middle class citizen, I don't expect to be some pampered prince. I just want to think that if I work hard, I can expect to be rewarded. And with things looking the way they are looking, it get's harder to think that every day.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Asakura

I live in Texas, you have to be registered 6 months before you can vote.

I know alot of what I said can't be done by one person. But c'mon the Executive Office is only 1/3 of our goverment. Why aren't these issues being adressed by the Goverment as a whole instead of being put on the shoulders of the President? Maby I worded that wrong...why aren't these issues being solved? I'm sure there being adressed but obviously theres a wrench in the system. I don't claim to know what that is but it seems like theres something wrong.

I'm not trying to bash the U.S. Goverment, but isn't their job to ensure the saftey, well being, and prosperity of this country? If it is, in my opinion the job isn't being done correctly. I'm a lower-middle class citizen, I don't expect to be some pampered prince. I just want to think that if I work hard, I can expect to be rewarded. And with things looking the way they are looking, it get's harder to think that every day.

I agree with you 100%.

Now that we have a Democratic Congress and a Republican Presisdent, a lot of movement just stops. Bush has been vetoing bills like crazy since losing the Republican majority, but it takes 2/3 of a vote to override a presidential veto. That only just happened (an override) for the first time recently.

So I don't blame EVERYTHING on the president, I am very disappointed in the lack of cajones in the Congress, as well.

But we are at the end of of one of the worst 2 term presidencies in the history of America. The setbacks made not only in the economy and the national debt, but in personal freedoms, environmental responsibility, the strength of the dollar, and the all-important general reputation of the US in the world have all gone down the poop-chute.

I beleive it is time for a major change. Nothing to do with race or age, but I think we should give Obama a go at it. He can't do any more damage than Bush, and already McCain is promising to keep a lot of Bush's policys and programs going. These last few years have been hard on our family. McCain's words promise nothing better. Obama's do. Is it a gamble? Sure. But why would I vote for the guy that's going to keep me struggling vs. the guy who is going to at least try and give me a chance?

[Sangetsu]

double post

[Sangetsu]

Originally Posted by MMM

I didn't casually dismiss all your concerns, I adressed them one by one. If we are going to make every mis-statement by a candidate to be fact, then McCain has some real doozies. But I'd rather be concerned with facts about the candidates, not flubs.

If Obama was still in Rev. Wright's church, yes, I'd be concerned.

If Michelle Obama hadn't apologized and reworded her statement, yes, I'd be concerned.

If Obama and Ayers were still working together on the same committee and Ayers was still involved in subversive activities, yes, I'd be concerned.

If Obama's mother were still alive and was spouting Anti-American drivel, yes, I'd be concerned.


But these are all "ifs". None of them are actuals. I am concerned about actuals.

And Sangetsu, you may not understand the role of superdelegates. The responsibility of the superdelegates is not to vote with their constiuency (most of them don't have a constituency) but to vote for the candidate they beleive can beat the Republicans in November. That's all. Does politics play a role in politics? Of course, but don't make it sound like Bill Richarson broke the rules or his responsibilities in choosing Obama.

Nothing we are going to say is going to change each other's minds. But I always do enjoy a lively debate.

I understand the irony of the super delegate system. So much for "one vote, one voice". At one time in America, the right to vote was severely restricted. Only white, male land owners had that right. The logic at the time was that landowners were the ones who paid the taxes and levied the militias. It was also argued that the right to vote was too important to be trusted in the hands of the ignorant.

As the country evolved, the rules were changed, and pretty much all adults were given the right to vote. Both political parties were champions in their way of giving this right to all people, but I hate it when I see that parties are still able to finagle around the wishes of the people for what they think is the "greater good". If that were, and is still the case, what was the point in giving all people the right to vote?

I don't oppose the Electoral College system used to elect the president. Though people may not know it, it is the states who elect the president, and not the people. One might argue that the super delegate system and the Electoral college system are principally the same, but they are not, the Electoral College is a blanket system to which all parties must adhere.

I keep hearing about how "historical" this election is. It is not "historical", it is "hysterical". Hillary is more of a man than her husband ever was, and it's interesting how a half-black man becomes fully African American when he's running for political office. What you see as "historical" is nothing of the sort, it's the same cereal made by the same machine, but served in a different box.

This election should be the most important in history; we've rarely needed good leadership as much as we need it now. But once again we are forced to choose between puppets instead of men.

[Retrogamer77]

Originally Posted by Sangetsu

I keep hearing about how "historical" this election is. It is not "historical", it is "hysterical". Hillary is more of a man than her husband ever was, and it's interesting how a half-black man becomes fully African American when he's running for political office. What you see as "historical" is nothing of the sort, it's the same cereal made by the same machine, but served in a different box.

This election should be the most important in history; we've rarely needed good leadership as much as we need it now. But once again we are forced to choose between puppets instead of men.

THANK YOU!

People always think I'm crazy or something when I say, "But Obama isn't black." I have no problem with him wanting to identify himself with being African American. But in my eyes he will always be bi-racial. It's still a huge step forward, but the whole race hysteria is bugging me more and more every day. I'm getting sick of people telling me I only want to vote for him because he's black (I'm black). It's usually then I choose to mention that he is in fact not black, but bi-racial. I get some half assed reply and then just stop listening actually.

But yes, I support him because I'm willing to take a chance. As far as Hillary, I was never able to trust the words coming out of her mouth and that was/is one of my biggest problems with Bush. I would never vote for McCain because I disagree with his views on pretty much everything. And I know Obama doesn't have the 'experience' that most people think he should have. But look at the people running our govt. now. As far as their 'experience' goes it's not helping us too much in the long run. I'm not saying it doesn't matter at all, but at this point our country needs something totally different. I'm still not 100% sure that Obama is that something, but I'm more than willing to make a gamble.