China: New Superpower?

[MMM]

Originally Posted by noodle

Huh... The only time I ever bring the US into this is when a hypocritical statement is made.

That's my point. We aren't talking about the US. We are talking about China. Again, my nationality decides whether or not I am allowed to have an opinion. I am tired of this double-standard.

Originally Posted by noodle

I pretty much guessed what you were gonna say on this thread before you even said it.

That's a wonderful trait of yours I have been enjoying.

Originally Posted by noodle

Whether you admit it or not, you have something against china without knowing any sound facts. Having an opinion is all well and good until you talk about changing their culture, or how they're not an influence to the world etc.

Since I am the only one who has to quote his sources I will tell you I get my information from several western news sources, a local friend of mine from Shanghai, a friend who lives in Hong Kong and a friend from Taiwan. I based my opinions after weighing that information. Is it a perfect system? No. Better than most? I think so.

Originally Posted by noodle

Ever considered that there was a reason for doing that instead of what you just assume to be negligence?

The contractors that built the school refuse to defend their building methods on camera, despite the parents of the children who died having a constant vigil demanding answers. They showed the concrete blocks used to build the school and they literally crumbled in the father of a dead girl's hand. "To save a little money they sacrificed our children's lives."

But you are right. I shouldn't rush to judge. There very well have been a legitimate reason for using cheap and unsafe materials to build an elementary school. I will wait patiently for the builders to come out into the open and give their side.

Originally Posted by noodle

Yes, Business men... The people that cheat their way into doing something cheaply without considering the concequences... One shouldn't complain about China as a whole when it's a minor group of people commiting offenses, because the truth of the matter is, China has excellent business ethics and brilliant prospects for the future... Unfortunately, you won't see too much of the good side on tv right?

We are talking about "China". If you want to break it down into different people, fine. "Chinese business men" have problems in the "culture of environmentalism, safety and health". But not all of them.

[Payne222]

If the People's Republic of China became the
world's new superpower,
I'd say another World War would erupt.
No one would take it sitting.

EDIT - Haha I put no one would take it standing...that doesn't make sense. XDD

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

MMM, you dont seem to be packing a punch anymore...

Chinese polution is high because of its population, not because each person uses excess amounts of carbon fuel and dumps toxic waste everywhere; that is what the US is like. Another reason that causes Chinese polution is because small companies, such as computer recycling companies (you might want to note the recycle part), that are based at river beds can not afford the expensive waste disposal programmes you have in America. This is the result of poverty, not poorly hearted people. People working at places like this earn only a few dollars a day, and more often than not the owner of the factory sleeps in a shoddy apartment, also, the only real difference in lifestyle would be he lives alone and can afford a second hand car over a 7 year loan.

Mocking the Chinese is something that requires some pretty in depth research. Like Noodle said, you should go and see the country. Thailand is little different from China. I can clarify things you hear on the news that are warping your mind, such as; they dont burn rubbish because they are lazy, people burn their rubbish because there is no rubbish truck. What is the soultion for this? Employ a fleet of 20,000 rubbish trucks to patrol small rural areas each maned with 3 men; and how much is that cost? ... Oh wait, there was another solution; impose sanctions! LOL, whatever.

They will burn their rubbish until the economy picks up and they can afford to create the new jobs they need to bring it up to Swedish standards. (NOT US standards, as they are the worst in the world, regardless that their rubbish is not burnt).

You can not be taken seriously unless you are considering things like this. It is easy to sit on your chair at home and throw criticism, but when it comes to fixing the problems I think you will be found a little dazzled. Like everyone else, that is; no one can fix it. It just takes time. So you want to cry over spilling milk, why not just let China alone?

Noodle and Ivion: full length berkas that expose only the eyes looks seriously weird.

I never said anything about Chinese pollution and burning their garbage. Noodle mis-read me.

Again I am very aware of how much pollution the US produces.

How about not talking about the USA, as that isn't the point of the thread?

If going to China is required to have a legitimate opinion, then I will shut up now.

[ivi0nk3y]

Originally Posted by MMM

I never said anything about Chinese pollution and burning their garbage. Noodle mis-read me.

Again I am very aware of how much pollution the US produces.

How about not talking about the USA, as that isn't the point of the thread?

If going to China is required to have a legitimate opinion, then I will shut up now.

Well to be honest, someone who has been to China and experienced it first hand will have a much more solid opinion than someone who hasn't. Doesn't mean you can't have one but it just means that you prolly shouldn't be so staunch in your arguments against China and could probably take in what others say a tad more?
Really, what do you give weight to more, an opinion or whether that opinion has a reasonable amount of validity?

[MMM]

Originally Posted by ivi0nk3y

Well to be honest, someone who has been to China and experienced it first hand will have a much more solid opinion than someone who hasn't. Doesn't mean you can't have one but it just means that you prolly shouldn't be so staunch in your arguments against China and could probably take in what others say a tad more?
Really, what do you give weight to more, an opinion or whether that opinion has a reasonable amount of validity?

That's funny, you say I am too staunch and Tenchu says I have lost my punch.

I really don't think I have been unreasonable in my arguments. There were some misunderstandings about what I was trying to communicate, but I think (hope) those are all cleared up. I have no ill feelings toward Chinese people. As a consumer in a country which has moved almost all production to China, I am frutrated by my goverment's inability to protect me from sub-standard products over and over again. I will be honest in saying I have as much faith in the Chinese government to clean up thier act as I do in the American government. Yes, I know some people are trying. It's the same in the US. Change is slow.

But you guys have been to China and know more about it than me. Believe it or not, I do not reject any of your guys' arguments. I read each one carefully. When I am called things unfairly, then I will defend myself with vigor, but that isn't unlike anyone else.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by ivi0nk3y

First and foremost, WHAT facts? Have you actually ever seen a Chinese news bulletin or have you just heard about it through whatever material you've acquired through the "Western" media. (Obviously that includes the internet, teaching and the news itself. )
Yes I can call it "Western" media because ultimately it has the "Western" doctrine and ideals written all over its views and opinions. It is linked because no matter where in the West you go, that same doctrine and ideal will be prevalent on news reports that need a certain spin. If my Israeli example was not enough for you, I would've thought that Alkindus' post would've filled in the so called "Evidence" that you wanted from me. Apparently though his post didn't cut it with you and when faced with "evidence" you totally skirted it. What happened to your generic stance on "The Western media doesn't conspire" then?
Obviously you didn't understand a word I wrote earlier, that such tactics are used by the Western media to put spin on their news.
Also asking to get evidence from me is rather silly since I don't record any news and really have no idea where to find it on the internet. I haven't been bothered to look for it either. However I KNOW from experience that such "propaganda" occurs as do plenty of other people. Those ARE the facts that I and a lot of people DO know. Unlike your FACTS, ours are actually quite unbiased.
If suddenly I started recording all the stories that supported my argument, you would have nowhere to turn to.
Also in that case, the answer you gave to Alkindus, ("ignoring is not the same as lying") would hardly be acceptable.

I'm also surprised with your vast facts and unsurmountable knowledge, that you might not have seen this.

YouTube - George Galloway Savages SKY NEWS!

George Galloway destroys that news reporter, with all its evident spin and propaganda. (SKY is pretty huge here.)
If you can't see it, then you aren't as intelligent and in line with facts as you think you are.

Jeez you're grasping at straws... how does any of what you say PROVE that a)- The Western media lied about China's actions in Tibet.
b)- The Western media having a conscious, POLITICAL agenda.

As for Alkindus "evidence". If you look at those stories half of those stories were US-centric. Of the ones that were relevant, they were either not mentioned OR under-reported (meaning they were reported BUT they weren't detailed enough considering that this institute felt they were important).

Look I've given you the facts of how the Western media works... you simply can't get it through your head. All you've given me in return are snippets of incidents in which the media has not done it's job properly as "proof". George Galloway slams that reporter... big deal. You think that one incident "proves" anything more than that? Where did I say the media was perfect?

Originally Posted by ivi0nk3y

Hmm interesting outlook on it. Cept you're an Atheist and that is a Buddhist quote. So.. a self-proclaimed Atheist accepting the quote from a religion. What a novel idea?
I guess its ok to be contradictory and hypocritical when that quote applies to any set way of thinking.. which includes yours?
Then again I guess its alright to forget that when you're trying to make your point, just like the Western media when they don't "lie" but choose to "ignore".
Just like this.

YouTube - If Americans Knew What Israel Is Doing! VIDEO WAS CENSORED!

Of course these points just deal with Israel, of which you claim is reported on fairly and openly.
Haha.
Also, applying random quotes to Islam from an imperfect source, won't actually further your point anywhere cept in the eyes of morons who can't tell their backside from their face.. but I digress.

You're an idiot. Buddhists CAN BE atheists dipshit (rather it is not necessary for buddhists to worship a deity but it is up to them). Atheist does not mean a-religious or a-spiritual. Maybe you should get an education before you talk shit.

By the way. With regard to that little video there. Who do you think produced that video? The Western media did fuckwit. I've also seen tons of documentaries via the Western media on the crimes of Israel.

[ivi0nk3y]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

Jeez you're grasping at straws... how does any of what you say PROVE that a)- The Western media lied about China's actions in Tibet.
b)- The Western media having a conscious, POLITICAL agenda.

As for Alkindus "evidence". If you look at those stories half of those stories were US-centric. Of the ones that were relevant, they were either not mentioned OR under-reported (meaning they were reported BUT they weren't detailed enough considering that this institute felt they were important).

Look I've given you the facts of how the Western media works... you simply can't get it through your head. All you've given me in return are snippets of incidents in which the media has not done it's job properly as "proof". George Galloway slams that reporter... big deal. You think that one incident "proves" anything more than that? Where did I say the media was perfect?

Damn you are an inept pompous little shit arent you?
First you ask for "evidence" that supports your little understanding on how the media works. Then you don't even have the brain power to remember all the shit that's been discussed in the previous posts.
I've given you snippets of ONE incident which you said you didn't believe. That would be the fact that Israelis are given a different spin rather than Palestinians. I forwarded it as an example of how biased the Western News can be.
Why did I post Galloway slamming the reporter? Because it shows the bias of the media and prevalent attitude they display when that type of news story is told. In this case Galloway was obviously there to correct that bullshit attitude but guess what idiot? He isn't there everytime is he? They won't post up a new clip of him savaging some reporter everytime will they? That clip is RARE simply because noone challenges reporters and the bullshit the media spews, like Galloway does.
That same media attitude occurs on more than one occasion and it is your incompetence which stops you from seeing it.

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

You're an idiot. Buddhists CAN BE atheists dipshit (rather it is not necessary for buddhists to worship a deity but it is up to them). Atheist does not mean a-religious or a-spiritual. Maybe you should get an education before you talk shit.

By the way. With regard to that little video there. Who do you think produced that video? The Western media did fuckwit. I've also seen tons of documentaries via the Western media on the crimes of Israel.

What a goddamned failure you are. You seem to have an understanding of Buddhism that supports your own menial understanding of the universe.
Allow me to educate you via a quick summary on the teachings of Buddha concerning a deity.
First and foremost, Buddha did initially say that finding a God was not as important as righting the sufferings of the world. Yet he never denied the existance of God either. If anything he kept quiet because India at that time was flooded by Idol worship.
Later on the religion of "self help" was turned into the religion of "promise & hope", since the Dhamma just didn't cut it with people. The Mahayana sect eventually made a God out of Buddha himself, saying his watchful and compassionate eyes are on all miserable beings.
Do you understand yet how Atheism has nothing to do with Buddhism now dipshit?
Oh and in my earlier post, I didn't actually insult you. Now you can just go ahead and kiss my ass you arrogant shit.

ps. Holyyyyyyy crap you stupid stupid man. You might have seen LOADS of videos on documentaries but i'm talking about how many of those facts make it onto the Western NEWS media.
Differentiate the two yet moron?

[Thunda]

Dudes, I love the language. Just...just keep arguing.

[Fisher]

Originally Posted by Payne222

If the People's Republic of China became the
world's new superpower,
I'd say another World War would erupt.
No one would take it sitting.

EDIT - Haha I put no one would take it standing...that doesn't make sense. XDD

are u stupid or something?

[Henbaka]

So.... anyways. I just heard the chinese government is closing down several factories now to clear the air before the olympics. Can't have the people of the world think they have problems with pollution I guess...

Of course, afterwards back on they go..