Bullying

[mercedesjin]

Originally Posted by MMM

Of course if you can "prove" someone bullied someone, then they bullied. I am saying just because you feel bullied or discriminated against doesn't mean that it happened. Human perceptions are ruled by emotion, and by nature, emotions aren't always rational or logical.

Let's say I go to a native Chinese restaurant and am seated before a Chinese-speaking group. I order first, but they get their order before I do. I may feel that because I am not Chinese I was discriminated against. However, that does not mean the Chinese restaurant owner discriminated against me. I may not realize that the other table called their order in on the phone before they arrived. So my perception and the reality are not the same.

On this site someone might say "Some mods don't know what they are doing." If I feel that comment is directed towards me, I may feel insulted. However that person could be talking about someone else, and therefore didn't insult me, whether I perceived it that way or not.

And yet I feel that emotional responses are underrated and that logic is overrated. Logically, according to scientists in the 1920s, homosexual men and women were "inverts" and "sick." Those scientists didn't pay attention to the fact that love - an emotional response - is really what fueled gay men and women, and that love is what fuels heterosexual men and women too. Logically, though, they were completely different groups of men and women - and one group deserved (and still deserves, apparently) more rights than the other. (I don't want this to turn into a discussion about gay rights. I was just using it as an example.)

Personally, I always pay more attention to a person's emotions and feelings more than cold logic - because logic constantly changes from culture to culture, from generation to generation. Emotions will always be the same. If you hurt someone's feelings, they will always feel pain.

[thcuteness]

I totally against bullying i was always bullied when i was younger and so were all my friends cause we were "different" and on top of that my best guy friend is homosexual so i constantly picked on and avoided by other guys, i always defend him, making me a prime tarket as well. After awhile i just got use to and stop paying attention to them. But i still hate bullies, main reason why im always in a fight at school defending a younger kid by kids in my own age group. Ive always find it wrong to descrimante against others weither they were smaller, "different", or homsexual, or for whatever other reason. So in simple words bullying makes me sick.

[mercedesjin]

Originally Posted by Tsuwabuki

I would not call that situation bullying. I would definitely call it conflict, but even though the girl was trying to "take him down a peg" there are obviously deeper reasons why she went after him, since he said this was not an isolated event. He did something she felt threatened her, so she has a pattern of instigation. This is not bullying. Bullying's sole purpose is to make one feel superior by taking the easiest course. Redressing a grievance through a disruptive outburst, real or imagined, is inappropriate behavior, but it isn't bullying.

I guess we'd have to agree to disagree on that one.

Vangaris:I don't think that it's contradicting. I think you're right. It should be stopped, but as far as I can tell, it has been and maybe always will be a part of human nature.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by mercedesjin

And yet I feel that emotional responses are underrated and that logic is overrated. Logically, according to scientists in the 1920s, homosexual men and women were "inverts" and "sick." Those scientists didn't pay attention to the fact that love - an emotional response - is really what fueled gay men and women, and that love is what fuels heterosexual men and women too. Logically, though, they were completely different groups of men and women - and one group deserved (and still deserves, apparently) more rights than the other. (I don't want this to turn into a discussion about gay rights. I was just using it as an example.)

Personally, I always pay more attention to a person's emotions and feelings more than cold logic - because logic constantly changes from culture to culture, from generation to generation. Emotions will always be the same. If you hurt someone's feelings, they will always feel pain.

By this logic, because I perceived discrimination from the Chinese restaurant owner, I should be able to sue him for damages. We go to trial and he says "No, the other table called their order in first, so that's why they were served first." And I would reply "But I felt discriminated against." And the judge would rule in my favor, and the Chinese chef would have to pay me.

This "logic" means I am responsible not only for my actions, but your feelings. That just doesn't work in my eyes.

[mercedesjin]

Originally Posted by MMM

By this logic, because I perceived discrimination from the Chinese restaurant owner, I should be able to sue him for damages. We go to trial and he says "No, the other table called their order in first, so that's why they were served first." And I would reply "But I felt discriminated against." And the judge would rule in my favor, and the Chinese chef would have to pay me.

This "logic" means I am responsible not only for my actions, but your feelings. That just doesn't work in my eyes.

That's just a serious difference between us, I guess. I feel that going to court is a pretty serious action that not many people take, and a pretty extreme example - but if you wanted to, and you had enough proof to show why you were discriminated against, then sure - you'd have a case. I'm not arguing that "Because I felt this way," would be a good argument. Like I said before, you'd have to show why you felt that way.

People are responsible for others feelings, in my view. Anything that I do can and will affect others. Me saying one thing could change a person's view on the world - negatively or positively. I've heard stories of people killing themselves because they've been bullied too much. I've heard of people who have to move to different states or schools because they've been bullied too much. So, yes - I do think it's important for a person to think about what they say, because what they say can and will affect others.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Vangaris

I highly doubt most of society cares about how you feel about being bullied, to be honest, MMM.

If you are going to make multiple accounts, the smartest thing to do is not engage mods, Ore.

[alanX]

I care about how you feel, MMM.

[Salvanas]

Originally Posted by MMM

If you are going to make multiple accounts, the smartest thing to do is not engage mods, Ore.

Busted.

10wordlimit

[bELyVIS]

MMM, I thought you and I were on her ignore list? You aren't being ignored.
To the rest of you, your fingers will get tired from typing way before your point gets across.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by mercedesjin

That's just a serious difference between us, I guess. I feel that going to court is a pretty serious action that not many people take, and a pretty extreme example - but if you wanted to, and you had enough proof to show why you were discriminated against, then sure - you'd have a case. I'm not arguing that "Because I felt this way," would be a good argument. Like I said before, you'd have to show why you felt that way.

People are responsible for others feelings, in my view. Anything that I do can and will affect others. Me saying one thing could change a person's view on the world - negatively or positively. I've heard stories of people killing themselves because they've been bullied too much. I've heard of people who have to move to different states or schools because they've been bullied too much. So, yes - I do think it's important for a person to think about what they say, because what they say can and will affect others.

You are changing things a bit here. You said other people are responsible for my emotions. My emotions is a feeling of discrimination.

If I discriminate against someone, then I am responsible for my action.

If someone feels discriminated against by me, by your words, I am also responsible for that.

Naturally, if I bully or discriminate, then I am responsible for my actions, but I can't be held responsible for other people's conceptions, misconceptions or feelings. You said you value emotion over logic.

What I am saying is you are responsible for your own actions AND emotions. It's like "He was mean and made me cry." Well, he might have been mean, but only you can allow yourself to cry.