Should the president be able to address school children

[MMM]

Originally Posted by solemnclockwork

Well, since you want to continue that.



You lumped EVERYONE who disagrees with the President speaking into one category, hence why I got mad.

Yes it does, when I highly parts you seem to leave out.




Your post, hence why I went and bold the parts I did. If you read what I have posted there wouldn't be a response in that way, I said that if a child gets inspired then it's Good!

MMM, Again I was not nitpicking how many hours he chooses to spend on anything, but his focus! If it was a non-argument then there wouldn't be any controversy. Just because you see one side, doesn't mean there is not another side to be seen. I would say the exact same thing for elderly and vets, why would you think I wouldn't (you use the words anyone so it does apply to me)? IT IS NOT BECAUSE OF THE CHILDREN, can you please stop with this. It shouldn't be a mystery I have completely given my view on it. where not debating what a speech is, or why a speech should be given.

First of all don't quote me as saying "you people" then highlight the words "you" and "people" in completely different paragraphs. I assumed you had misread what I had written, and it was a misunderstanding. Now I see you want to treat my posts like a jigsaw puzzle that you can mix and match words with. I don't play that.

You have still not explained why the most important and highest official in our nation should NOT address our nation's children as to why they should stay in school.

"He has better ways to spend his time" is not an argument.

As I child I was taught that even if we didn't like the policies of our president, we should respect him for the position he has earned. That level of respect has continuously been maintained for decades all up until January 20, 2009.

Suddenly people that respected the office of the president of the United States of America treat it as important as the winner of American Idol. The respect is gone. The trust is gone. And it's not because of 8 years of George W Bush.

Is this what we want to teach our children? That the man who fought hard and earned the majority of votes by the American citizens to become our president is deeply suspect and should be questioned at every turn, even at some innocuous events like telling children to stay in school?

What a sad statement for America if that is really true.

It truly sickens me that I have to type these words.

Good night.

[GodNickSatan]

I think having unconditional respect for anyone, particularly someone with as much power as Obama, is pretty sickening to be honest.

[solemnclockwork]

Originally Posted by MMM

First of all don't quote me as saying "you people" then highlight the words "you" and "people" in completely different paragraphs. I assumed you had misread what I had written, and it was a misunderstanding. Now I see you want to treat my posts like a jigsaw puzzle that you can mix and match words with. I don't play that.

You have still not explained why the most important and highest official in our nation should NOT address our nation's children as to why they should stay in school.

"He has better ways to spend his time" is not an argument.

As I child I was taught that even if we didn't like the policies of our president, we should respect him for the position he has earned. That level of respect has continuously been maintained for decades all up until January 20, 2009.

Suddenly people that respected the office of the president of the United States of America treat it as important as the winner of American Idol. The respect is gone. The trust is gone. And it's not because of 8 years of George W Bush.

Is this what we want to teach our children? That the man who fought hard and earned the majority of votes by the American citizens to become our president is deeply suspect and should be questioned at every turn, even at some innocuous events like telling children to stay in school?

What a sad statement for America if that is really true.

It truly sickens me that I have to type these words.

Good night.

Dude, we where warned about this.

But no you want to make a fuss out of this when I disagree with you. WoW so I don't care for children since I seem to think the President should at least right now focus on Health care? So I'm a bad American. DO YOU REALIZE how much you being like the "extreme conservative side"?

Do NOT start with the respect issue, the same can be said for both sides of the view when it comes to this issue in the current political environment. YOUR side is NOT blameless, you did it to Bush, but complain when it done to Obama? I HAVE NOT said one negative thing about him, and even said if he inspires a single child to do great THEN IT WAS A SUCCESS. I have a different view then what he should be focused on, SO WHAT, everyone does.

"he has better ways to spend his time" is a argument AS I have backed that up with several instances where time could be spent on something else. You don't agree, but it is a thought out position.

LET ME REPEAT, IN my view there are more pressing concerns to giving a speech (IT is NOT about who he is giving it to, but what it is about, i.e. not health care). Do NOT sit there and spin it, and denies that I have repeatably gave you a answer.

First of all don't quote me as saying "you people" then highlight the words "you" and "people" in completely different paragraphs. I assumed you had misread what I had written, and it was a misunderstanding. Now I see you want to treat my posts like a jigsaw puzzle that you can mix and match words with. I don't play that.

I'm sorry, but in respect maybe I should have worded it better, but the content REMAINS.

If it sickens you, then don't type those words to make you out to be the better person in a opinionated question. So if you choose yes your right and choose no your the devil?

MMM, go look in the mirror you find you starting to act like those who you disagree with so much.

[samurai007]

Originally Posted by MMM

George Bush Sr. encouraged children to stay in school.

Ronald Reagan encouraged children to stay in school.

Both in exactly the same way that President Obama will do next week.

Why is there an assumption that President Obama has an ulterior motive?

Flashback 1991: Gephardt Called Bush's Speech to Students 'Paid Political Advertising' | NewsBusters.org

Flashback 1991: Gephardt Called Bush's Speech to Students 'Paid Political Advertising'


Photo of Noel Sheppard.
By Noel Sheppard (Bio | Archive)
September 3, 2009 - 10:45 ET


As Barack Obama prepares a nationwide broadcast to America's students next Tuesday, it has been revealed that Democrats complained in 1991 when then President George H. W. Bush broadcast a speech from a Northwest Washington junior high school.

In fact, the House Majority leader at the time, Dick Gephardt (D-Mo.), said "The Department of Education should not be producing paid political advertising for the president, it should be helping us to produce smarter students."

Such was reported by the Washington Post on October 3, 1991 (h/t KY3 Political Notebook via Chuck Todd):

House Democrats criticized President Bush yesterday for using Education Department funds to produce and broadcast a speech that he made Tuesday at a Northwest Washington junior high school.

The Democratic critics accused Bush of turning government money for education to his own political use, namely, an ongoing effort to inoculate himself against their charges of inattention to domestic issues. The speech at Alice Deal Junior High School, broadcast live on radio and television, urged students to study hard, avoid drugs and turn in troublemakers.

"The Department of Education should not be producing paid political advertising for the president, it should be helping us to produce smarter students," House Majority Leader Richard A. Gephardt (D-Mo.) said. "And the president should be doing more about education than saying, 'Lights, camera, action.' "
Two House committees demanded that the department explain the use of its funds for the speech, an explanation that Deputy Secretary David T. Kearns provided late in the day in a letter to Rep. William D. Ford (D-Mich.), chairman of the House Education and Labor Committee. Education Secretary Lamar Alexander was out of town. [...]

Rep. Patricia Schroeder (D-Colo.), chairwoman of the Select Committee on Children, Youth and Families, said it was outrageous for the White House to "start using precious dollars for campaigns" when "we are struggling for every silly dime we can get" for education programs.

Rep. Martin Frost (D-Tex.) said that if Bush feels obliged to use government funds to hire outside consultants "to make him look good," then he should fire some of the public relations experts on the White House payroll. "Then the president might be more sympathetic to unemployment benefits," Frost said, referring to Bush's threat to veto legislation to extend benefits.

Makes one wonder if today's media, with the economy in what they've repeatedly called the worst recession since the Great Depression, will question Obama's use of education funds for his upcoming speech.

After all, when you look at Education Secretary Arne Duncan's letter concerning this event, one has to assume it's costing the Department a great deal of money.

So Dems complained like crazy when Bush Sr did it, so what's good for the goose...

Besides, Obama has already proven himself untrustworthy several times, he refused to release the contents of the speech (why is it such a big secret?), his "homework" included the phrase "How can you help the President?", which suggests something the President is asking of the kids, not just "stay in school and study hard" (because why would kids need to "help the President" if that were the only message?) Obama is a weasel, and if I had kids, I sure wouldn't allow them to be subjected to Obama's lies and indoctrination like this.

[Columbine]

At the risk of fishing in troubled waters, you know how many times my school got a spoken message from the P.M.?

Not even once. Oh there was a general mixed messages of "All you young people need asbos, STAY IN SCHOOL! Wait! let me give you a hug first, oh but by the way, your exam results are a joke and you're failing the nation" but that was all on a national news level. It might have been quite interesting to hear what these politicians had to say for themselves and how they wanted to approach ME.

If you ask me, this sounds like a cracking opportunity for teachers to get kids thinking about politics on a more relatable level. "Ok, kids, Obama's had his say to you, now what do you think? what did you agree with/disagree with?" and if it's all really a big sinister lie, the kids will smell a rat.

Seriously, give them some credit, they can't all be mindless meat-sack dupes. The schools with kids who's parent's like him will probably already like him. The one's with parent's who don't, won't be swayed, or if they are, mummy and daddy and teacher will 'expose all Mr. Obama's nasty little lies' and it will be back to square one regardless. Some ~might~ disagree with their parent's opinions, but I doubt they'd voice it. Not for some man who lives a million miles away from their own realities.

Is it a waste of time? The message itself isn't bad and it seems to me like the good and the bad of the reasonings (on BOTH sides of the argument) are pretty balanced. I mean, people can gnash and wail and say "it's a popularity stunt" but... everyone can perhaps already see that, and it's not really getting him much popularity is it? Just a lot of negative controversy. "Won't someone think of the children!?" well sure, why don't you? You can't disagree with what he says unless you let him actually say it. You can only throw a tantrum about what you THINK he might say, which is unfair.
That's simply taking the mere fear of one person putting words into the mouths of babes and actually planting your own opposing ones instead.

IF it is really such an issue, even if you disagree with it, can't you just talk it over with your kids? Emphasis the 'good' messages and express your doubts about the others. The older kids will appreciate a dose of adult honesty, or a chance to make their own opinions and the younger ones probably aren't interested anyway. Write him a letter. Let them write him letters. Get the comm. channels open and busy, criticize if you want, but it doesn't seem to me like snarling and fear-mongering is doing America, or the kids, or the reputation of an otherwise great nation any good at all.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by solemnclockwork

But no you want to make a fuss out of this when I disagree with you. WoW so I don't care for children since I seem to think the President should at least right now focus on Health care? So I'm a bad American. DO YOU REALIZE how much you being like the "extreme conservative side"?

I never said "you people". I never said you don't care about children and I never said you were a bad American.

I can't continue this with you, solemnclockwork, you are aren't arguing against what I said.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by samurai007

Flashback 1991: Gephardt Called Bush's Speech to Students 'Paid Political Advertising' | NewsBusters.org



So Dems complained like crazy when Bush Sr did it, so what's good for the goose...

Besides, Obama has already proven himself untrustworthy several times, he refused to release the contents of the speech (why is it such a big secret?), his "homework" included the phrase "How can you help the President?", which suggests something the President is asking of the kids, not just "stay in school and study hard" (because why would kids need to "help the President" if that were the only message?) Obama is a weasel, and if I had kids, I sure wouldn't allow them to be subjected to Obama's lies and indoctrination like this.

it is interesting that politicians complained about the use of funds for Bush Sr's speech, but that isn't the complaint that people are making about Obama's speech. The Republican Party of Florida said Obama would "indoctrinate" school children with "socialist ideology," forcing them "to watch the president justify his plans for government-run health care, banks, and automobile companies, increasing taxes on those who create jobs, and racking up more debt than any other president."

That is different. It also creates paranoia about the president, making him into a boogie man that we need to protect our children from. What kind of message does THAT send to children? That is much more insidious and ugly.

And well stated Columbine. I think you have situation pretty well summed up.

[YukisUke]

Originally Posted by MMM

George Bush Sr. did it as well, and George Bush Jr. went to an elementary school on the morning of 9/11/2001. It is a bit of a presidential tradition to speak to school children on the first day of school. But for some reason when President Obama wants to do it it is called indocrination and brain washing.

I just wish America would just stop being so judgemental about the man. Ever since the inaugeration, he's had an invisible camera on him the whole time watching his as well as his family's every move. That's not the way it should be. I just can't take this anymore. And now the people are losing confidence in him. For what? What did he do to have the people lose confidence in him?

[burkhartdesu]

This Democrat/Republican Rightwing/Leftwing bullshit is all an act, a distraction from the real problems in our society. It doesn't matter who you vote for, where they stand.


Truth is, our Government is ran by the Federal Reserve - we are slaves to inflation and the Federal Income Tax.



Ron Paul .com

[jesselt]

Originally Posted by samurai007

So Dems complained like crazy when Bush Sr did it, so what's good for the goose...

Besides, Obama has already proven himself untrustworthy several times, he refused to release the contents of the speech (why is it such a big secret?), his "homework" included the phrase "How can you help the President?", which suggests something the President is asking of the kids, not just "stay in school and study hard" (because why would kids need to "help the President" if that were the only message?) Obama is a weasel, and if I had kids, I sure wouldn't allow them to be subjected to Obama's lies and indoctrination like this.

As MMM pointed out, the two cases are hardly alike.

It's sad how so many people are going to try and censor their children from a simple "Stay in school" speech and feed them lines about how terrible Obama is, when they spent the previous 8 years screaming at people who didn't stand to support the president or wear a little American flag pin.

When you purposely don't let your children see opposing points of views (though you could only possibly be opposed to this speech if you were anti-schools) you are purposely brain washing them.