Tea-Party Rallys

[Ryzorian]

The world hates us because we are us, hate to burst your bubble on that. Powerful nations are hated because they are powerful, it's the nature of the game.

The economic collapse was caused by stupid loans being given to people who never should have had them. It was done through mandatory law put in place By Chris Dodd and Barny Frank and signed in 1999 by Clinton. Bush warned about that situation in 2002, 2003, 2004, 2006, and 2007. Each time it was rebuffed by Frank and Dodd who claimed it was just "republicans" trying to wage war on poor people. Bush's main fault was not stopping that crap before it got out of hand.

This situation is going to get much worse with how things are now. The great depression was compounded for years, by government getting in the way. This will be no different.

[JustinATTACK]

Originally Posted by GTJ

I think they're just the repubs and conservatives and right wingers who didn't get McCain and are pissed so they're taking it out on Obama. Yes, the economy sucks, but whose fault is that? Also, which president did nothing to stop it, even spurred it on? Uh, Bush. If anybody undermined everything about the States and the Constitution it was Bush. Obama is cleaning up the mess right now, and he's got a long way to go. Why are people being so critical of him? Yeesh. Like I said, they're just mad they don't have someone in office to ruin the country and make the world hate us for another 4 years.

No one president is to blame for the state our country is in..
The presidents we have elected lately have just been rather horrid.
People blamed everything on bush when he was in office,
but now that he isn't in office anymore, it does no good to complain about him.

SO people move on to the next object that they are able to vent on.
OBAMA! Assuming that venting their accumulated anger at the current president will do any good they gather and protest.. But it will get them nowhere.

Our nation is arrogant and falling to ruin, at an ever increasing rate.
The only way to fix what has been destroyed, would be to reinstate true democracy.. Which many Americans would be happy to do, but because of the power the current shit hole we call our govt. has that will never happen.

[MMM]

Interesting alternative opinion.

I don't agree with everything he says, but I like his angle.

the oft-stated logic of "government out of my life" is a fantasy existence you've never experienced, and that you'd whimper in fear over were you ever subjected to it for an instant. Make a list of the industries you're aware of: medical, chemical, automobile, steel, housing, whatever. Each and every one of them would crush you with glee without government regulations if it added to their profits by one one-millionth of a percentage point. They'd sell the juice they squeezed out of you as a refreshment drink, if they could get away with it. As corrupt and inefficient as your government is (and it clearly is), it's the only thing keeping you alive moment to moment. Reform it, by all means. Keep it honest. Throw out the bums who aren't protecting you adequately enough. But, end its involvement in your life? Scale it back? You're kidding yourself. That's a joke. Take one look back at history (please, just one look!), and see how workers, and children, and consumers are now protected where they were once injured and exploited. That's called "progress," and we're hoping to add a little more.

[GTJ]

Originally Posted by Ryzorian

The world hates us because we are us, hate to burst your bubble on that. Powerful nations are hated because they are powerful, it's the nature of the game.

Hmmmm... the American PEOPLE are hated as a result of being fat, loud, obnoxious, and ignorant, most noticeably the tourists, those on whom other countries base their opinions of the nation at large on. The government is hated because it had really crappy foreign policy for the past 8 years. Oh, and everyone knew Bush was an idiot. EVERYBODY.

The economic collapse was caused by...

Yes, yes, we know.

This situation is going to get much worse with how things are now. The great depression was compounded for years, by government getting in the way. This will be no different.

If you said this a few months ago I'd agree. We already passed that point. Look at the stock charts. Things are getting better. THIS recession was compounded for years, and the shit hit the fan HARD last fall. It bottomed out recently and has been slowly recovering since. It's slow, but it's happening.

Anyway, what were we talking about? Oh yeah, tea parties.

[komitsuki]

Originally Posted by JustinATTACK

The only way to fix what has been destroyed, would be to reinstate true democracy..

What is true democracy, by the way?

The American model – democracy – must be regarded as a historical error, economically as well as morally. Democracy promotes shortsightedness, capital waste, irresponsibility, and moral relativism. It leads to permanent compulsory income and wealth redistribution and legal uncertainty. It is counterproductive. It promotes demagoguery and egalitarianism. It is aggressive and potentially totalitarian internally, vis-à-vis its own population, as well as externally. In sum, it leads to a dramatic growth of state power, as manifested by the amount of parasitically – by means of taxation and expropriation – appropriated government income and wealth in relation to the amount of productively – through market exchange – acquired private income and wealth, and by the range and invasiveness of state legislation. Democracy is doomed to collapse, just as Soviet communism was doomed to collapse.

Hans-Hermann Hoppe's "Demokratie. Der Gott, Der Keiner Ist"

[GTJ]

Originally Posted by komitsuki

What is true democracy, by the way?

The American model – democracy – must be regarded as a historical error, economically as well as morally. Democracy promotes shortsightedness, capital waste, irresponsibility, and moral relativism. It leads to permanent compulsory income and wealth redistribution and legal uncertainty. It is counterproductive. It promotes demagoguery and egalitarianism. It is aggressive and potentially totalitarian internally, vis-à-vis its own population, as well as externally. In sum, it leads to a dramatic growth of state power, as manifested by the amount of parasitically – by means of taxation and expropriation – appropriated government income and wealth in relation to the amount of productively – through market exchange – acquired private income and wealth, and by the range and invasiveness of state legislation. Democracy is doomed to collapse, just as Soviet communism was doomed to collapse.

Hans-Hermann Hoppe's "Demokratie. Der Gott, Der Keiner Ist"

Are you subscribing to someone else's ideology rather than forging out your own? Come on man, just READ that paragraph and a rational mind will see all that's wrong with it. It's a classic case of tunnel vision.

Let's all just keep in mind that Democracy--which has been implemented in countless other societies to great success--is an idea that came from humans. Humans are imperfect beings and as such imperfections are bound to arise. Live with it If you don't like it, go live somewhere in Africa, the Middle East, China, or North Korea where you don't have any need for silly things like freedom.

There's a reason the United States has historically been called "the Great Experminet"!

[MMM]

Originally Posted by komitsuki

What is true democracy, by the way?

The American model – democracy – must be regarded as a historical error, economically as well as morally. Democracy promotes shortsightedness, capital waste, irresponsibility, and moral relativism. It leads to permanent compulsory income and wealth redistribution and legal uncertainty. It is counterproductive. It promotes demagoguery and egalitarianism. It is aggressive and potentially totalitarian internally, vis-à-vis its own population, as well as externally. In sum, it leads to a dramatic growth of state power, as manifested by the amount of parasitically – by means of taxation and expropriation – appropriated government income and wealth in relation to the amount of productively – through market exchange – acquired private income and wealth, and by the range and invasiveness of state legislation. Democracy is doomed to collapse, just as Soviet communism was doomed to collapse.

Hans-Hermann Hoppe's "Demokratie. Der Gott, Der Keiner Ist"

Before you conclude your reading of this statement as a well-tailored opinion, the uninformed should know that Hans-Hermann Hoppe is by no means a main-stream thinker. He thinks all security should be run by private, for-profit organizations. Eliminate fire, police, court systems, prisons etc. and make them all private. In my opinion these ideas (Anarcho-capitalism) are untested and insane. Actually they aren't completely untested...we have private security forces in Iraq. The problem is, private security forces are for profit. Therefore there is no vested interest in ending war...any war...as to end it puts yourself out of a job. Now apply that to police, fire, court systems, etc.

Have you ever heard of windshield glass companies breaking car windows? Corrupt private tow-truck companies? Private ambulance companies getting paid off to take patients to certain hospitals, even if they were father away? This is "no government regulation". Again, imagine if your police station, prison, and fire house were all for profit...and we complain about government corruption now.

[samurai007]

Originally Posted by Ryzorian

The world hates us because we are us, hate to burst your bubble on that. Powerful nations are hated because they are powerful, it's the nature of the game.

The economic collapse was caused by stupid loans being given to people who never should have had them. It was done through mandatory law put in place By Chris Dodd and Barny Frank and signed in 1999 by Clinton. Bush warned about that situation in 2002, 2003, 2004, 2006, and 2007. Each time it was rebuffed by Frank and Dodd who claimed it was just "republicans" trying to wage war on poor people. Bush's main fault was not stopping that crap before it got out of hand.

This situation is going to get much worse with how things are now. The great depression was compounded for years, by government getting in the way. This will be no different.

Well thank goodness, at least 1 other person besides me on these boards knows the real reason for the economic collapse. GTJ, if you knew about this, why spout the lies about Bush spurring it on? He warned about it, tried to stop it, but didn't try hard enough IMO.

By the way Ryzorian, as I'm sure you know, Frank, Dodd, and many others collected huge campaign donations from Fannie and Freddy for many years. But in the space of less than 2 years, a certain young Senator from Illinois surpassed all recipients total amounts except Chris Dodd. That Senator hit them extra hard, threatening lawsuits for racial discrimination if they wouldn't lend to minorities whose credit ratings and background suggested they were unlikely to ever be able to repay the loan. But the Senator assured them that the US govt would bail them out if/when the loans were defaulted on...

[GTJ]

Originally Posted by samurai007

GTJ, if you knew about this, why spout the lies about Bush spurring it on?

lol, "spouting lies". This sounds like... Big Brother? Or fundamentalism. Or extremism. Or right-wingers. Or something like that. spouting lies... honestly. Who even uses the word "lies" like that anymore! Just because you don't agree doesn't make it a "lie". Silly repubs.

[burkhartdesu]

Originally Posted by Ryzorian

The economic collapse was caused by stupid loans being given to people who never should have had them.

The economic collapse was the result of a 100 years of inflation from an unfounded monetary system.