Korea Japan relations

[Jaydelart]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

hmmm... I think this might go beyond resentment over the war and colonization but I agree that it contributes to it.

The show didnt touch on this... but I have a theory that intense nationalism in South Korea is to a large extent, the product of compulsory military service.

Its just my own theory though and I think its a good idea for a research grant if it hasnt been done (so anyone specializing in Korean or East Asian studies.... you are welcome )

I don't mean to sound too patronizing... but, what does "intense nationalism" imply from your judgement, exactly, and what experience do you have with the Korean culture or people?

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Jaydelart

I don't mean to sound too patronizing... but, what does "intense nationalism" imply from your judgement, exactly, and what experience do you have with the Korean culture or people?

By intense nationalism.. I simply mean that consciousness of the nation (which in Korea is generally defined by race) and national identity is high.

Though of course Im not saying that all Koreans are racist... just that the society in which they live predisposes them to racism moreso than say, Japanese society.

Experience with Korean people?... I dont think its relevant as Im talking in generalities about society rather than individuals.. but for what its worth, I dated a Korean once, and have friends of Korean heritage (though they arent Korean). I have some friends from South Korea too... but they arent close friends.

[Jaydelart]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

By intense nationalism.. I simply mean that consciousness of the nation (which in Korea is generally defined by race) and national identity is high.

Though of course Im not saying that all Koreans are racist... just that the society in which they live predisposes them to racism moreso than say, Japanese society.

Experience with Korean people?... I dont think its relevant as Im talking in generalities about society rather than individuals.. but for what its worth, I dated a Korean once, and have friends of Korean heritage (though they arent Korean). I have some friends from South Korea too... but they arent close friends.

So, we're basically saying Koreans are racist -- or are prone to a form of racism which is more advanced than in Japan?

I just want to make sure I'm grasping your point clearly, sorry if it seems like I'm being redundant.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Jaydelart

So, we're basically saying Koreans are racist -- or are prone to a form of racism which is more advanced than in Japan?

I dont know how you came to the conclusion of the former when I clearly went out of my way to explain that I WASNT saying that....

Anyway, the latter is closer to what Im saying... but its not exactly what Im saying.

Korea is a more nationalistic society. This nationalism is very much racialist (Though Japanese nationalism is the same). This makes Koreans more prone to being racist.

That 71% of Koreans surveyed said they hate Japan, not only does this statistic suggest that my viewpoint is pretty accurate, but it also makes me aware of the fact that it could be worse than I thought it was.

[Jaydelart]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

I dont know how you came to the conclusion of the former when I clearly went out of my way to explain that I WASNT saying that....

Anyway, the latter is closer to what Im saying... but its not exactly what Im saying.

Korea is a more nationalistic society. This nationalism is very much racialist (Though Japanese nationalism is the same). This makes Koreans more prone to being racist.

That 71% of Koreans surveyed said they hate Japan, not only does this statistic suggest that my viewpoint is pretty accurate, but it also makes me aware of the fact that it could be worse than I thought it was.

I came to the conclusion of the former by means of simplification of the latter, hence my use of the word 'basically'... but I digress... I don't agree. In terms of personal theories and observations, I'm more inclined to think that Japan is generally more prone to racism than Korea. And I'm being unbiased.

South Korea is on the brink of war, and has been for a long time. This may be the cause for its nationalism. It may be a very important factor in this issue. You agree that this nationalism is race-based, and I'm convinced that's it's natural and unavoidable; obviously, who else will suffer South Korea's home struggle other than the South Koreans (excluding soldiers from other countries). History has also displayed S. Korea's significant dependancy on and acceptance of foreign national bodies such as America. This indicates a certain level of tolerance of outside influences in comparison to that of Japan. Japan is not completely unlike Korea, which you and I agree on, but it can't share this position to the same extent as Korea, in my opinion, and almost has what seems like the complete opposite: in history, an initiative of invasion. Which is why I pointed it out originally.

Of course, I'm aware we're just trading opinions at this point. lol

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Jaydelart

I came to the conclusion of the former by means of simplification of the latter, hence my use of the word 'basically'... but I digress... I don't agree. In terms of personal theories and observations, I'm more inclined to think that Japan is generally more prone to racism than Korea. And I'm being unbiased.

South Korea is on the brink of war, and has been for a long time. This may be the cause for its nationalism. It may be a very important factor in this issue. You agree that this nationalism is race-based, and I'm convinced that's it's natural and unavoidable; obviously, who else will suffer South Korea's home struggle other than the South Koreans (excluding soldiers from other countries). History has also displayed S. Korea's significant dependancy on and acceptance of foreign national bodies such as America. This indicates a certain level of tolerance of outside influences in comparison to that of Japan. Japan is not completely unlike Korea, which you and I agree on, but it can't share this position to the same extent as Korea, in my opinion, and almost has what seems like the complete opposite: in history, an initiative of invasion. Which is why I pointed it out originally.

Of course, I'm aware we're just trading opinions at this point. lol

The difference between your opinion and mine is that yours draws parallels between history and attitudes today that dont exist, therefore is as valid as the opinion that the Earth is the centre of the universe.

To the average Japanese person... Japan's period of isolation is a chapter in a history book. I assume that it is the same with most Koreans (though some of the more recent movements involving takeshima/dokdo as well as the dispute between a mountain near the Chinese border seem to invoke pre-20th century claims)

Furthermore... Japan after WW2 is an entirely different beast than Edo Japan.

It would be like assuming America is more racist than Japan because America had a history of the belief in white supremacy.

Not to mention that I can actually give you a statistic that backs up my opinion.

[Jaydelart]

What's occurred to me is that your statistics seem to refer only to the Japanese-Korean relationship.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Jaydelart

What's occurred to me is that your statistics seem to refer only to the Japanese-Korean relationship.

You are right. Though I dont think its hard to see how the stats give my position merit.

It shows that 71% have the ability or mindset to hate another country at the very least.

And as was said by one Japanese person on the show... "The question of hating another country is an old one which belongs to a different era"