Feelings Toward Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

[WingsToDiscovery]

Originally Posted by Suki

I was just pointing out how the US always seems to be in the middle of all major human catastrophes. It's not only an opinion but a proven fact. Every country that has a war going on, the US's in it somehow. And strangely enough, American citizens seem to back up every move made by their army, like they truly believe they're doing a great job by being sent away from their homes to propagate peace and democracy. Like taking part in a war they have no business being in is the best way to make their ideals prevail.

My father now has partial paralysis in his neck and is now stuck working an office job with disability at age 43 as a result of an engagement while serving in the current conflict in Iraq. You honestly think we all support the war? While I harbor no ill will towards anyone in the Middle East, it's not like the majority of us actually support the war itself. We're supporting our families who are told they have to go. You really are a fool.

[GoNative]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

Was Hiroshima Necessary?

My god this is the best you can do? This organisation was founded by an ex member of the British National Front (a white supremecy group) and the head of the now defunct Liberty Front which was an anti semitic organisation. They have been involved in denial of the holocaust in Europe and are not considered to uphold any of the established methods for mainstream historical research.
I really suggest you you check your sources a little better for information.

Or just do what so many do these days and find anything off the net (because you can easily find just about anything) to support your views. It's easy to post anything you want on the internet when you don't have to go through any peer review or have to go through any of the normal checks of your methodology to be published in a credible journal.

[termogard]

Originally Posted by RickOShay

Your ignorance towards the events of WW2 and particularly of those leading up to the dropping of the bombs is made more than clear by this statement. I suggest you try and gain some understanding before jumping on the modern-day bash America bandwagon. In short you don't know what you are talking about, so stop talking.

You called my post about bombings of two japanese cities by US nuclear devices as "ignorance towards the events of WW2 ", huh?
Boy, go play your toy gundams or console games instead of desperate attempts to chat with adult persons.

Originally Posted by GoNative

And how many countries did Japan invade and how many civillians did they kill on their little crusade through Asia? America (and other allied nations) were the saviour of these countries and their peoples. A bit more went on than just an attack on a naval base and the subsequent dropping of nuclear devices on Japanese cities. 10's of millions of lives were lost as a direct result of the Japanese invasion of Asia. People sometimes seem to forget that Japan was the aggressor not the US who helped liberate most of the countries occupied by the brutal Japanese forces..

[Sigh} Yes, Japan was the aggressor. Yes, japanese forces occupied many asian countries. But it can not justify nuclear bombings of japanese civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Plain and simple.

Originally Posted by GoNative

believe there is a very good case that the atomic bombs helped end the war considerably earlier than it would have otherwise and saved many more lives (both allied and Japanese) from a protracted war on Japanese soil than died as a result of the bombings.

Unfortunately, history doesn't know such terms as "if", "could", "would", "should".

[GoNative]

Originally Posted by termogard

[Sigh} Yes, Japan was the aggressor. Yes, japanese forces occupied many asian countries. But it can not justify nuclear bombings of japanese civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Plain and simple.

In your opinion.

Originally Posted by termogard

Unfortunately, history doesn't know such terms as "if", "could", "would", "should".

And you know this because of your vast historical knowledge and qualifications?

[dogsbody70]

Originally Posted by termogard

You called my post about bombings of two japanese cities by US nuclear devices as "ignorance towards the events of WW2 ", huh?
Boy, go play your toy gundams or console games instead of desperate attempts to chat with adult persons.




[Sigh} Yes, Japan was the aggressor. Yes, japanese forces occupied many asian countries. But it can not justify nuclear bombings of japanese civilians in Hiroshima and Nagasaki. Plain and simple.




Unfortunately, history doesn't know such terms as "if", "could", "would", "should".

Please study more-- You clearly do not have a clue what you are talking about.

[Suki]

Originally Posted by MMM

Come on. this is just more run-of-the-mill America bashing. That's so 2007 on JF.

But let's look at some of the greatest catastrophes in human history.

The Great Fire of London in 1666?

The Bhola Hurricane of 1970?

The 1960 Chile Earthquake?

The Indian Ocean Tsunami of 2004?

Sorry, Americans may have been killed in these events, but Americans didn't cause them.

Are you talking about war?

WWI? Not started by Americans

WWII? Not started by Americans

The Korean War? Not started by Americans

Vietnam? Not started by Americans

So really, enough is enough. It is an opinion and a misguided one.

Ok, I should have said "non-environmental catastrophes caused by humans". That's what I meant.

And yes, the US is always involved in wars that don't concern them. Look up a timeline of US military operations carried out in the last 30 years.

Originally Posted by MMM

You clearly know NOTHING about what American people think and how they feel about being in the Middle East right now.

Now? It's taken what, ten years? George Bush even got reelected for God's sake, that alone speaks for itself.

Originally Posted by Columbine

They are NOT herding innocent civilians to death camps with the view to commit genocide. You undermine the incredible suffering of the victims of the holocaust with your gauche comparisons.

Taxi to the Dark Side

Tortures all the same.

Originally Posted by Columbine

according to your argument, the rest of the world shouldn't interfere anyway. Let them get on with it!

No! Let the US fix it! Let them invade the country with their troops, that'll surely make everything better ¬¬

Military intervention does not lead to conflict resolution. All the opposite.

[termogard]

Originally Posted by GoNative

In your opinion. :

I am not alone.

quote :

A number of notable individuals and organizations have criticized the bombings, many of them characterizing them as war crimes, crimes against humanity, and/or state terrorism. Two early critics of the bombings were Albert Einstein and Leo Szilard, who had together spurred the first bomb research in 1939 with a jointly written letter to President Roosevelt. Szilard, who had gone on to play a major role in the Manhattan Project, argued:

"Let me say only this much to the moral issue involved: Suppose Germany had developed two bombs before we had any bombs. And suppose Germany had dropped one bomb, say, on Rochester and the other on Buffalo, and then having run out of bombs she would have lost the war. Can anyone doubt that we would then have defined the dropping of atomic bombs on cities as a war crime, and that we would have sentenced the Germans who were guilty of this crime to death at Nuremberg and hanged them?"[50]

Wiki

Originally Posted by GoNative

And you know this because of your vast historical knowledge and qualifications?

Yep. If you need further confirmation, ask any historian.

[termogard]

Originally Posted by dogsbody70

Please study more-- You clearly do not have a clue what you are talking about.

Oh, really? Is that sentence represents all arguments you can add to discussion?

[dogsbody70]

Originally Posted by WingsToDiscovery

My father now has partial paralysis in his neck and is now stuck working an office job with disability at age 43 as a result of an engagement while serving in the current conflict in Iraq. You honestly think we all support the war? While I harbor no ill will towards anyone in the Middle East, it's not like the majority of us actually support the war itself. We're supporting our families who are told they have to go. You really are a fool.

Its a bit like the Brits who were drawn into the IRAQ conflict after 9/11.
There were huge protest marches here against us getting involved but Blair was hanging onto Bush's coat tails.

It sems to me that ever since 9/11 that is when the war on terrorists began.

I still do not Know why We are even in Afghanistan?


Soldiers are trained to fight-- its never the Presidents or Prime Ministers that fight-- they just like to send Our men as fodder.


during ww2 conscientious objectors were either imprisoned or sent to work in the MINES etc.

[WingsToDiscovery]

Originally Posted by termogard

I am not alone.

You'll also find this (since you've use Wiki as well):

"Of the total deaths in World War II approximately 85 percent—mostly Soviet and Chinese—were on the Allied side and 15 percent on the Axis side. Many of these deaths were caused by war crimes committed by German and Japanese forces in occupied territories...Roughly 7.5 million civilians died in China under Japanese occupation..."

"The most well-known Japanese atrocity was the Nanking Massacre, in which several hundred thousand Chinese civilians were raped and murdered.
Between 3 million to more than 10 million civilians, mostly Chinese, were killed by the Japanese occupation forces. Mitsuyoshi Himeta reported 2.7 million casualties occurred during the Sankō Sakusen. General Yasuji Okamura implemented the policy in Heipei and Shantung.
The Axis forces employed limited biological and chemical weapons. The Italians used mustard gas during their conquest of Abyssinia,while the Imperial Japanese Army used a variety of such weapons during their invasion and occupation of China and in early conflicts against the Soviets. Both the Germans and Japanese tested such weapons against civilians and, in some cases, on prisoners of war."

Along with an appropriate picture of Chinese civilians being buried alive on the webpage.