BRANCH: WWII and Star Wars

[Ronin4hire]

Thanks MMM for making this into a seperate thread.

Here's why the destruction of the death star was justified.

It was a weapon of mass destruction with the ability to destroy whole planets.

While it is unlikely there were civilians on the original death star, the incomplete death star orbiting Endor might have had slave labour aboard as the Empire was reknowned for their practice of slavery. I'm thinking probably Wookies. I'm willing to concede this.

I would still say that the destruction was justified though. The completion of the second death star would have made the Empire all but invincible and the wookies that died on board would have been sacrificed for the freedom of the entire planet of Kashyyk as well as other slaves that might have been used.

The Alliance was less a rebel alliance at the time of ROTJ and more of an entirely new political entity made up of worlds that had yet to be subjugated by the Empire. With the Death star complete and fully operational, the Empire would have no problem in threatening these worlds into joining the Empire.

That would force the rebels back into the rag tag force they were at Yavin stripping them of many resources and equipment that was supplied to them and pretty much sealing their fate.

In effect the Alliance had no choice but to destroy both death stars for the sake of themselves and the galaxy.

[protheus]

It's obvious it's all Chewbacca's fault.

[Ghap]

What the hell lets go all the way and do a cross over with LOTR..we could have Gandalf standing in the trench shouting "you shall not pass" while ben kenobi and yoda's ghost go medievil on the undead that betrayed gondor under the strobe lighting of palpatine and the eye doing there thing.

and

if were blessed some teddy bears winning the day then using the decapitated heads as musical instruments.


hey i like star wars too but take care of your subject matter.

some things should not be made fun off.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

In effect the Alliance had no choice but to destroy both death stars for the sake of themselves and the galaxy.

I am curious if you (or anyone else) think the American government and military thought any differently in the summer of '45. "We can end this war right now, but it is going to change history and how wars are fought forever..."

I understand the argument to destroy the Death Stars, and don't disagree, but we are thinking about the loss of innocent life. We cannot accurately guess how many non-military personnel were on DS-1, but I think we can estimate that there were more than zero. A military base does not survive with only military personnel. There need to be cooks, at the least, as well as other off-duty distractions. No one has ever chastised the Rebel Alliance for the mass destruction of the Empire's Death Stars with no discrimination for those that that some were simply innocent individuals at the wrong place at the wrong time. The Battle of Yavin is considered an unconditional victory for the Rebels (as is the Battle of Endor). Should the Rebels have shown more responsibility, or is the fact that the Death Star itself a military target excuse any residual damages?

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Ghap

What the hell lets go all the way and do a cross over with LOTR..we could have Gandalf standing in the trench shouting "you shall not pass" while ben kenobi and yoda's ghost go medievil on the undead that betrayed gondor under the strobe lighting of palpatine and the eye doing there thing.

and

if were blessed some teddy bears winning the day then using the decapitated heads as musical instruments.

hey i like star wars too but take care of your subject matter.

some things should not be made fun off.

Who is making fun? If you do not like the discussion you are free to not participate, but I would challenge you to find a post that doesn't take the topic seriously. The only one making fun seems to be you.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by MMM

I am curious if you (or anyone else) think the American government and military thought any differently in the summer of '45. "We can end this war right now, but it is going to change history and how wars are fought forever..."

It is understood that most of the US high command thought the dropping of the a bombs unnecessary as well as many of the scientists behind the Manhattan project.

Originally Posted by MMM

I understand the argument to destroy the Death Stars, and don't disagree, but we are thinking about the loss of innocent life. We cannot accurately guess how many non-military personnel were on DS-1, but I think we can estimate that there were more than zero. A military base does not survive with only military personnel. There need to be cooks, at the least, as well as other off-duty distractions. No one has ever chastised the Rebel Alliance for the mass destruction of the Empire's Death Stars with no discrimination for those that that some were simply innocent individuals at the wrong place at the wrong time. The Battle of Yavin is considered an unconditional victory for the Rebels (as is the Battle of Endor). Should the Rebels have shown more responsibility, or is the fact that the Death Star itself a military target excuse any residual damages?

I can confidently say there were no civilians on DS-1 because of the existence of droids. The original death star was full of them and they were designed to take on all the menial tasks that in todays world get contracted out.

And in answer to the bolded question. Yes. It does excuse it. But again.. the only collateral would have been the slaves that MAY have been on board. (Remember I'm giving you that one as no source that I'm aware of points to slave labour being used in the construction of DS-2. I just assumed it due to the Empire's reputation for using slaves, especially wookies for hard labour.)

termogard had it correct earlier. The destruction of the death star is akin to the destruction of an aircraft carrier or a military base rather than the destruction of a city.

[Ghap]

Originally Posted by MMM

Who is making fun? If you do not like the discussion you are free to not participate, but I would challenge you to find a post that doesn't take the topic seriously. The only one making fun seems to be you.

Well I stand corrected.Sorry mate!

whats next?

1)Chernobyl! but in a carebear spin?

Radiation bear does the care bear stare?

2) 3 mile island with a ken and barbie spin?

heck it aint easy to look that good.


There are recent events in the west were such things wouldnt be acceptible...so why when people are still living in the aftermath of this particular event subject to discussions such as this.

Its a historical event if people wish to discuss the wrongs/rights of it i would make my own opinions more known....but i dont agree of hiding it in another discussion.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Ghap

Its a historical event if people wish to discuss the wrongs/rights of it i would make my own opinions more known....but i dont agree of hiding it in another discussion.

This discussion was born out of my comparison of Star Wars to the way Americans understand WW2.

It has evolved into this.

This is how discussions both on the internet and in real life work.

Now please... if you don't have anything to add then butt out.

[Ghap]

Originally Posted by Ronin4hire

This discussion was born out of my comparison of Star Wars to the way Americans understand WW2.

It has evolved into this.

This is how discussions both on the internet and in real life work.

Now please... if you don't have anything to add then butt out.

Well fair enough.

Im not American or to be honest Japanese.

So its just opinion..and you know what they say about those!

but before i go.....Hiroshima/Nagasaki conversations in real life merge into a star wars mythos.

only in a kevin smith film mate.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Ghap

only in a kevin smith film mate.

You must have boring friends.