Re Abortions

[dogsbody70]

ON another thread here a potential father is in a quandary re decisions what to do as his girll g=friend is pregnant and wishes to keep the baby.


I wonder what you views might be on abortions and whether the father of the baby should have a say in what happens. should he force the mother to abort the baby-- or even arrange an adoption-- should the woman be forced to Keep the baby if she doesn't want to keep it.

One hears of abortions where the foetus is 24 weeks before being aborted.

I am unsure of the law in the UK about limiting the length of pregnancy before aborting the baby.

when you see photographs of unborn babies it can seem horrific to just get rid of it.


They say some women never recover if they have aborted their baby. No doubt there have been thousands that nobody knew about.

should men be held responsible if the child is kept? should he support the mother and child?

[RobinMask]

Post Deleted.

[Suki]

I am pro abortion. I believe no woman should be forced to have a baby she doesn't want. Of course the father gets a say in what to do, but the mother's decision is what counts most of all as it's her body and she'll the one going through pregnancy.

[protheus]

Do any of you know the death rate of abortions gone wrong? This isn't a walk in the park, it's even riskier than an operation. It involves a lot of blood vessels that can burst.
The rate of girls not being able to have any children for the rest of the life because of an abortion is very high. So for a decision you made in your youth you may be unhappy for the rest of your life.
On the other hand, having a child and not having the means to support even the feeding, I can't imagine how it feels for the mother.

It's a very difficult decision, someone who choses one solution or the other shouldn't be criticized.

PS: Look up on the net for the data if you don't believe. I'm not a caveman from Cave country, I'm just pointing out the facts.

[RobinMask]

Post Deleted.

[princessmarisa]

Originally Posted by MissMisa

Lol, I don't know where you are from... but it's a very safe procedure here. It's extremely rare for any minor complications at all. (Of course, this is going on the basis that you make your choice within correct amount of weeks.)

But anyway, in this country, abortion is a perfectly safe and legal procedure that rarely causes harm to the mother, FYI. If abortions in your country have a DEATH RATE, then wtf - this is no way in the same realms.

Anyway it should be the mothers choice (depending on the stance with the father, she should take his opinion into consideration), mentally it certainly isn't a walk in park.

Sorry to disagree with you wifey, but abortions in the UK are still dangerous and will have some kind of death rate even if it is tiny. Even the first couple of weeks pill has many side effects and potential complications, any surgical procedure carries all the normal risks, then as it goes on the anaesthetic risks too. It is what we call a safe procedure though, compared to how it used to be, and many other operations.

It is a big decision for her to make to abort, just as it is to have the child, neither is easy or physically or mentally pain free.

I think it is a far less risk than choosing to bring up a child though, and agree often not the best choice to carry to term for a 19yr old at Uni but if she chose to keep we cannot judge her for that.

However we can perhaps judge this girl on how she expects the father to react, and the demands she is putting on him.

He does have a say in if he wants to be a father. If he chose not to be then in my mind for equal rights, he should be able to "abort" it from his point of view. Meaning if he wants to cut all contact (other than law forcing financial ones) and not be put on the birth certificate, then he shouldn't be judged for doing so.

She is the one who chose to keep the child (if she is against abortion on other reasons, she is still choosing to keep it if she doesn't give it up for adoption)
If she alone wants the child then she should be the one who has to deal with everything that bringing up a child involves, including finding a suitable male role model (a grandad and uncle, or a single steady bf) for the child.


OP I don't think you should feel pressured or morally bashed into being the worlds best Dad, or even a Dad at all if you don't want to be a Dad.
She had the choice if she didn't want to be a Mum, so it only stands to reason you can walk away from being a Dad.

I know lots of people will say this makes him a run-away father, and such, but think about it from the other angle. Society gives mothers the choice to not be Mums in many different ways, so shouldn't we think it acceptable for
fathers to chose not to be a Dad?

Of course they can't just keep changing mind and wander in and out of Child's life, it has to be a one off decision and agreement to not be involved at all ever.


Of course if you want contact and want to help with the child, then you also have every right to do that.

Just saying I think you have a choice, and I am sure the law doesn't force you to do more than pay money (I am not sure I agree with that, for the same reasons, but the law is the law)

[NanteNa]

Originally Posted by dogsbody70

I wonder what you views might be on abortions and whether the father of the baby should have a say in what happens. should he force the mother to abort the baby-- or even arrange an adoption-- should the woman be forced to Keep the baby if she doesn't want to keep it.

Should men be held responsible if the child is kept? should he support the mother and child?

NO, the guy should NEVER force his woman to get an abortion. An abortion is not only physically damaging to the woman's body (as you mentioned, it sometimes happens that the patient can never give birth again or even get pregnant) but mentally having to deal with the fact that you could've had a daughter or a son - ''what would he she look like?'', ''What would be his/her favorite dish?'', ''Would they be a pretty boy or a princessy girl?''.. It's all not put upon the guy's body - so he has NOTHING to say about it in my opinion.

Of course the guy should be held responsible if his gf chooses to keep the baby - if he doesn't wanna play daddy, then that's fine. But he should still pay till the kid's 18. IF the gf ''tricked'' him then he shouldn't have to pay tho; say if she said she was on the pill but wasn't, just because she wanted a baby.. But generally, he took part in the game. Consequences aren't just put upon ONE party of the fun here.

[Suki]

Originally Posted by protheus

Do any of you know the death rate of abortions gone wrong? This isn't a walk in the park, it's even riskier than an operation. It involves a lot of blood vessels that can burst.

You can have an abortion without surgical intervention if you do it very early in your pregnancy, like within the first 6 weeks. There's not much risk to it as it basically consists of taking drugs that will kill the fetus, then your body reacts to it and you have an induced miscarriage. Most women find out they're pregnant before they reach 6 weeks into their pregnancy, so a non-surgical procedure is always an option without much physical risk to it.

The thing is, most women have gotten further into the pregnancy when they decide to get an abortion, so the most used method is vacuum aspiration, where all content is suctioned from the inside of the uterus. And really, it ain't all that risky. It's a very simple procedure. Surgeons deal with much worse and complicated things all the time. This is something a first year intern would be able to do. Personally, I'd be more concerned about psychological damage than anything else. A woman can walk right out of the hospital on her own feet after getting this kind of abortion on the very same day she's had it, that's how simple it is.

[Ryzorian]

I guess it depends on wether you believe the unborn child is human and has as much right to life as any other human. That's the core arguement really, is the unborn child just a mass of cells that is no more "alive" than your liver, or is it in fact "John, Mary, Wanda, William"?

When is it alive? is it ever alive? can we decide that at 3 months? 7 months? 15 years? How bout late term abortions? should we allow those past 9 months? what about someone who survived an abortion, should the mother be allowed to abort them later when they are a teenager? What if the mother decides the baby's hair is the wrong color? is that ok for an abortion?

Some may laugh off the arguement, but it happened before. It's called ugenics and it was practiced by the Nazi's.

[ModusOperandi]

Originally Posted by RobinMask

It's a topic I don't usually like to comment on, because it's so sensitive to people and people are so passionate about it, it can potentially lead to a lot of criticism and arguments. . .

That said, I somewhat believe in abortion. I personally believe every and any life is sacred, that everyone has a right to live, and that if someone doesn't want a child that someone else will, and it's better to give an unwanted child to a loving home than to - in my eyes - murder it. I think women who get abortions every so often, using it as a form of contraception, are rather cruel and irresponsible.

However there are times when I think it's justified. If the child is likely to born extremely ill - and I mean extremely, not just for any illness - or if the mother's life is at risk, then perhaps a termination is best. I also think in cases of rape that it's justified, because the mother shouldn't be forced to endure birthing her rapists baby should she not be mentally/emotionally able to.

Ultimately it's the woman's choice - I won't condemn any woman who after thought and consideration thinks it's for the best, but I do dislike the idea and would never personally do it. If for whatever reason I didn't want a child I'd give it to someone who did. There's plenty of childless couples out there desperate for a child that I would otherwise be killing, and it seems selfish and self-centred to deny a child and a family that life just for my own selfish needs, just because its quick and easier.

I know many people will hate me for saying that, so please forgive me, but it's just my own feelings.

This post by RobinMask completely sums up my views on abortion.
I support it in the most dire of cases. It would be selfish of me to place some sort of judgment on those who have legitimate reasons to do so.

When it comes down to me as an individual, however, the very idea of termination is something I would never place as an option outside the threats a pregnancy may have to the mother's life.

I'd like to say I'm taking a political or spiritual stance on the situation, but realistically speaking, My characteristics -as an individual- wouldn't allow me to live my life wondering of what that child could have been. It would completely break my heart, I'm sure.

All in all, it's not like I have much say in the situation as a man, but you can believe I'd fight for it if I ever found myself in the situation.