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02-19-2011, 10:19 AM
Since this started out as a thread about immigrants, and this is the Japan Forum, perhaps it would be interesting to discuss Japan's view on immigration.
As many of you ate probably aware, few nations in the world are as monocultural as Japan. Immigrants make up less than 1% of Japan's population. Japan has more or less maintained a distinct culture, and this culture is highly valued by the Japanese. It is also admired by most of those who visit this forum. Japan's views on immigration are harsh. Immigration standards are high, and immigration laws are mercilessly enforced. Any Japanese can call a phone number to report a suspected illegal immigrant, and the police will investigate. Any foreign visitor can be questioned by the police at any time, and "probable cause" is not a requirement. Racial profiling is the norm. Japanese believe foreigners to be the major culprits when it comes to crime. This is partially true, as in America, foreigners in Japan commit a disproportionate amount of crime relative to their population, despite the strict laws which exist here. Race is not the issue, religion is not the issue, but culture is an issue. Japanese see their culture as a unique and valuable thing, and they do believe that increased or loosely regulated immigration will increase crime. In regards to religion, all people are animals, and religion is one of the world's main means to elevate people above their animal states. But like other things managed by man, the perfection aspired to by religion is corrupted by animal-like human behavior and instincts. There is no substantial difference between the main religions, nor their vulnerability to man's corruption. Even the Shinto priests here in Japan are not immune. Their shrines are often simply money-making machines which profits are often used to fund gold Rolex watches or pay for prostitutes. As for cultures, some are similar to others, some are strong, some are weak, some are good, and some are bad. To be successful in life (and success is the goal of life, right?), one should emulate the things which are successful, and abandon those which are not, and this should include culture. If you are immigrating to another country, then that new country becomes your country. It is not your right to ask that the country change to suit you, it is your responsibility to adopt the language, customs, and culture of the country which has adopted you. As for myself, I continue to study Japanese, including national history and politics. I participate in cultural events, even wearing traditional clothes. I pull my own weight here, working hard, paying my taxes, and improving the country by improving myself. A core principle of Japanese culture is the way of successive generations, by which each generation works hard to improve the life of the generation which follows. This same principle is followed by all other successful nations and cultures, but it is lacking cultures which have not been successful. It is important that immigrants from these cultures learn this basic virtue and take it to heart when they immigrate to a place like America, Japan, or elsewhere. 
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02-19-2011, 08:12 PM
What part of "none of these things define a culture" do you not understand Sangetsu?
Japanese culture can't be defined by it's regimental standards any more than another culture can be defined by its lack of. A liberal person who doesn't believe in any of the things you listed as being integral to Japanese society can still be Japanese and identify with Japanese culture.
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02-19-2011, 09:11 PM
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Ask yourself the question: "What is that I want to be successful for?" And than you'll have an answer which probably better reflects what'd be the goal of YOUR life. This question though, can give various results like: "I want to be accepted", "I want to be loved", "I want to be able to support my family", "I want to travel" and so on... but you'd hardly want to be successful just to become successful. What I'm saying is that success is undefinable without context, it varies individually. I mean there are loads of things which are not the slightest important for me(thus have nothing to do with my success) but, I won't say these things should vanish, nor that they are less important or valuable, especially when I don't know much about them... Not everything is about success in life nor in cultures, in fact most or many of the things which define one culture have not much to do with success... On topic: Once a 'country' has thousands of immigrants whom the country's government let or invited to be there, it's not just important to care for them and change for them as much as necessary but it's a duty. If/When America or any other nation chose to introduce stricter immigration rules, I gladly keep them, I respect the choice of your or any other nations' government. (Sadly for you your reputation is way ahead of your choices, I mean America is still the land of promise for too many people so no matter how bad it might be they try...) And I wont say your country is less tolerant because there are sticker rules with immigration. No, in fact I'd say it's a wise decision, cause you cannot just force hundreds of immigrants to change into the spit-image of the original occupants of your country, it's not possible, you have to care for them first and than when there's not much to take care of anymore, you can allow other hundreds or thousands of people to immigrate, whom you also must take care of. And if you cannot take care of them, than when you allowed them to come to your country, than you acted irresponsibly and probably made them suffer in the name of goodwill or because of negligence...
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02-20-2011, 05:02 AM
Gonative; pride is a sin by christian standards, probably by most religious standards actually. Pride is what led to Satan's downfall. So I can agree with much of what you say about pride. However, I think patriotism is important to a nation. It's that nations lifeblood, remove it and the nation dies from disinterest. I don't think patriotism is pride, I see it as the same reaction a father would have protecting his child. Only it's how the people react when thier nation is in danger.
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02-20-2011, 09:23 AM
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mmmm complicated-------------much i would like to say-- but immigrants should not expect a free ride.
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02-20-2011, 10:05 AM
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The object of life is not merely to exist, if such were the case, why bother with getting an education at all? The object of life is to grow, to improve, and to succeed. This is not about semantics, but about reality. Life is a classroom, and the things we learn allow us to grow physically, mentally, and spiritually. Success is a necessity to life, and is not unique to human beings; even animals are driven by the need to succeed. To succeed in hunting, to succeed in breeding, to succeed in self-defense. Anyone who argues that success is not an essential part of all life simply cannot be taken seriously. In humans the need to succeed is a little less stringent, but it is essential all the same. You receive a paycheck from your company each week or month only because your company has been successful enough to stay in business and share part of that success with you. I have been told that that 90% of human beings in the world are simply inert, living day-to-day, pursuing their small dreams, but never wandering outside their small sphere of existence. The more I read here the more I come to believe it is true. They resemble little dogs on short chains who bark and growl when someone walks into their yard, but who run around with their tails between their legs if turned loose. The movers and shapers of the world belong in the other ten percent. Those who are not part of this 10% derive much of their livelihood from it. Do you or your parents work for a company, store, or shop? If this company, store, or shop were not successful, and went out of business, what would you or your parents do? Would you still argue that success wasn't a fundamental part of your life? Would you run around like a little dog with your tail between your legs while you waited for a government unemployment check to come to compensate your personal lack of success? Or would you be motivated to get behind the wheel of your own life and become part of that 10% whom decide their own destiny?
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02-20-2011, 04:29 PM
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I was just saying it cannot be solved without both parties. It needs both the immigrants' and their new homes' efforts as well. Quote:
Surely we agree about the necessities of life(if not in their importance), and now you're saying exactly what I am. Success is a necessity to life - and not the goal of life... Here's necessity by definition: something needed for a desired result. So success is a tool after all and you also know it. (: Well, if you just want to disagree with me I'm fine with that, but than you should at least agree with yourself... Your other points... well I don't feel like addressing them, it's not even necessary anymore...^^^
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02-20-2011, 05:24 PM
lol @ Sangetsu.
How obtuse can a person be? We start off talking about culture and now we're on to his absurd, neo-feudal worldview where 90% of us are dogs that have no vision and we must praise our corporate overlords for their contribution to society. What a presumptuos, arrogant ****. He'll try and make you think he knows what he's talking about with his "worldly" experiences but it's obvious that he had such preconceptions about people before he travelled.
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02-20-2011, 11:54 PM
Sangetsu is showing us all why pride is such a dangerous thing. Because he has had some modicum of business success, his pride in his achievements has made him believe that he is better than others.
One major thing he fails to understand is that the definition of success can differ for everyone. Not all of us have any desire to be a 'mover and shaker'. It simply wouldn't make us happy. In fact the more 'successful' I was in my career and the more money I made generally the unhappier I was because to be successful meant spending more and more time working and not doing the things I really love doing in this life. I don't look back on my life and think of my successes financially (and I have had considerable successes but they mean little to me other than a means to live a reasonably comfortable life). I look back on my life and think of all the countries I travelled to, all the mountains I climbed and skied and all the exciting adventures I had and the wonderful people I met. And now of course I am part of the long term adventure of raising a child which is certainly one of the best adventures I've had so far. These are the successes in my life. I may never be a mover and shaker but damn I've had a pretty fulfilling life just the same. To me the only measure of success that's worth anything is how happy you are.
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