Reverse racism

[dogsbody70]

Originally Posted by Demitrichan

Yet if you take everything seriously things will never be good. You have to balance make jokes and work to change it. If you don't work to change something debating this was not but a waste of time.

what are you some ancient philosopher.?
its easy to patronise and tell others what they should do. thereare many situations and most often people from similar backgrounds congregate together into sort of ghettos.


when i lived in london often there might be one white child in a classroom amongst black children, because all the housing was taken up by black people. the shops sell goods suitable for the taste of the incomers. i used to have dancing lessons with a handsome indian gentleman but my white friends disapproved

when idi amin kicked many of his people out of his country-- we took many of them in. we have had to adjust to many changes over the years-- much because of the rights of those who had been part of the british empire.

the influx from the west indies etc in the fifties.

now we are part of europe--- so many economic immigrants can come here.

i spent a lot of time in childrens homes in the forties/ early fifties, children who were product of alliances between english women and visiting troops were often half black.half white and they were abused by other kids because they were different.


this country has had to learn to assimilate with each other, but real integration and mixing with everyone should mean many ways and enthusiasm to share together and really communicate with each other, ghetto type situations make that really hard.


a willingness on all sides to really try to understand each other--


those born here have every right to feel british-- if their parents also make efforts to learn our ways.

[termogard]

Originally Posted by MissMisa

It makes me sad, I'm English and I want a defined culture. I wish people from other cultures would have embraced our culture a bit more, but now everyone has brought their own with them and ignored ours then it's kinda dead. It'd be nice if people just took the effort to speak English at the very least.

The solution? You have to defend your lifestyle and culture. By all means. If they have no desire to accept British culture and live and work together with locals in peace, they should be sent back to country of origin.
Something like Sarkozy already did in France. Harsh, yes, but very true.

[dogsbody70]

Originally Posted by termogard

The solution? You have to defend your lifestyle and culture. By all means. If they have no desire to accept British culture and live and work together with locals in peace, they should be sent back to country of origin.
Something like Sarkozy already did in France. Harsh, yes, but very true.

well i would hope that in a university situation there wpuld be great opportunities forsharing all traditions and amalgamising-- having fun learning from each other.


so much depends on the area one is brought up in. high rise flats with few opportunities for youngsters to play not enough community facilities. can create many frustrations and kids get into trouble.


suburbs can be remote from the lives of those who live in social housing,

there are many who struggle to survive because of atrocious cost of housing-- plus not enough housing for locals-- yet alone incomers.

many say this is a rich country--- i say it is very expensive country for the majority-------------- try renting a decent house or flat. how many hundreds of thousands of pounds that strangle many hard workers who cannot even stay at home for long to bring up their own children.


its expensive living here.



our hospitals often rely on doctors and nurses from abroad, thats okay so long as they speak and understand english really well-- otherwise dangerous mistakes can be made

[Mavira]

I'm afraid I don't know how to 'tag' people in quotes, so please bear with me.

Where I come from, in my opinion I see racism happening more against white people than anyone else, and it isn't taken as seriously as when it happens to people that aren't white.

Oh dear. It appears your white privilege is showing, MissMisa.

Race/gender should be irrelevent.

No it shouldn’t. Race and Gender each hold important problems, and by suggesting this you are ignoring these problems.

I'm sure everyone wants to get somewhere based on their own merits rather than getting somewhere because they are a girl, or because they are disabled, or because they are an ethnic minority because the company/institution 'needs diversity.

I’m not sure what you are getting at here. Are you implying that a number of the ethnic minorities in your University got in on merit of their race, as opposed to achievement?

Point proven. It's not racism because it's white people.

Racism equals prejudice plus power. In a white majority country it is possible to experience prejudice or even discrimination for being white, but as the whites hold power, it is not racist. White people are not being oppressed by POC, and our race rarely becomes an issue in our lives.

That is not to say I approve of white discrimination, however. Any discrimination is a serious issue and should be handled accordingly.

Your hypothetical situation, which probably isn't even true considering 90% of the people in that area are asian (you'd be stupid to be racist against asians in an area that's 90% asian)

Institutional racism.

In my Uni, I am the minority

This may be, but you are the overwhelming majority in this country.

Calling me a 'white bitch' is calling me a white bitch, whether white people are the majority or not is completely irrelevent.

Are you seriously implying that being called a ‘white bitch’ is in any way the same as being called a racial slur? Being called the N-word, or a ‘chink’, or any other similar term does more than just hurt people’s feelings.

I don't care if their mum told them white people are bad when they were young, or they've had bad experiences with white people.

You are being dissmissive of and belittling the struggles many face every day.

Multiculturalism to me should be people living and working together, but what's actually happened is large groups of each race live in seperate places. It's like they have territory.

This is not because they choose to do so. Please watch this video. If you don’t want to watch all of it, at least skip to about 6:00 and watch to the end (It is about New Orleans but I feel it is relevant).

I don't really think England has a national identity anymore. It makes me sad, I'm English and I want a defined culture. I wish people from other cultures would have embraced our culture a bit more, but now everyone has brought their own with them and ignored ours then it's kinda dead.

The BNP and EDL reciprocate these sentiments.
On top of which, I don’t know what you think a defined culture is, because I’m English and I experience English culture every day.

It'd be nice if people just took the effort to speak English at the very least.

Once again, you are speaking from a very privileged position. Have you put any thought at all into why this might not be as easy as it sounds?
Also, what do you believe is ‘enough’ effort?

[dogsbody70]

hi mavira who are you. who do you think u are

[Mavira]

Originally Posted by dogsbody70

hi mavira who are you. who do you think u are

Excuse me?

[dogsbody70]

i wanted to help teach english to foreign immigrants. i was told that my english would not be good enough and it is only people who have gone through the tefl or efl courses etc that could teach english to incomers, i cannot afford to pay for those courses-- some costing up to £2000. i am a pensioner and if over 70 odd years of living in the uk is not good enough to try teach or help incomers-- then i don't know what is.

my japanese friend has spent a fortune attending an efl school-- but still cannot understand when english people speak to her.

i am only too willing to get to know incomers from anywhere-- but the stupid rules and regulations do not help one iota,

a lovely indian family moved nearbye a few years ago-- i tried to be friendly-- but the lady of the house told me that We do not like them. i wished to help her with her english-- but she was too scared.


she assumed that she was not wanted whereas i would have relished befriending her and her family.

[dogsbody70]

Originally Posted by Mavira

Excuse me?

your attitude towards miss misa is uncalled for so who exactly are you

[evanny]

Originally Posted by Mavira

Are you seriously implying that being called a ‘white bitch’ is in any way the same as being called a racial slur? Being called the N-word, or a ‘chink’, or any other similar term does more than just hurt people’s feelings.

it doesn't matter how one is called. it is the meaning that counts.

i can say " hey my niga brother from my other mother!" with greatest of joy when again finally meeting a friend of mine who is black. so..i said nigga - doesn't mean i view this person as a slave.
it doesn't matter what was the phrase - only thing that matters the context and intended meaning since that's what hurts - not the word itself.
video for you

P.S and WTF does a word - nigger - does more than just insult someone in some cases? what other fucking properties does this word has? it plays golf? washes dishes?

[Mavira]

I live in Bradford. It's one of the poorest/worst cities in the UK.

Economic privilege is not the same as white privilege.

Race/gender shouldn't disallow you from achieving your goals.

I agree. But you suggested race/gender should be irrelevant. I said that we should not ignore race and gender, as ignoring this means we also ignore the problems that come with race and gender.

They used to (it used to be a University policy, a while back.). And that is insulting to them, because they are perfectly capable of getting the same results as anyone else.

If it was a policy, I can see why it would be problematic. But you gave no evidence, so I was inclined to believe you assumed it.

I disagree. That whole idea is just ridiculous. Come live here and see how much race is barely an issue in my life.

You don't think racism is about power and oppression?
I did not deny that you had experienced discrimination,as I do not know you, but rather that discrimination and racism are not the same thing.

And?

You benefit from being white regardless of where you are in the country.

I've been called a 'chink' too. I was told to get out of a park because white people aren't allowed there when I was a little girl. I've had a number of other experiences I don't want to post on the internet. Are you saying those are less serious just because I'm white? Are you saying if I told a black person to get out of a park for being black, it would be worse because they aren't the majority? Seriously? If so, words fail me. It affected me the same way as any person would be affected in that situation.

Did you read my argument? That's not what I was saying at all.

We all face struggles. We don't all use them as excuses for violence.

I didn't say it excused it. I implied that you don't seem to understand what racism is, other than at surface value.

I don't remember ever saying they chose to, or it was their fault. It's not even about race, it's about the fact they are poorer. I want a country where the poor/rich gap isn't so wide, so that people could afford to live together and celebrate diversity.

The way you stated it seemed to be implying that the minorities were purposefully segregating themselves. I apologise if I misinterperted you.

Exactly the point I made. By saying I want to know what England is about, I'm put in the same category as the BNP and EDL. Bravo, bravo.

You said that immigrants were causing the decline of British culture, which is exactly what those two parties state.

Considering you know nothing about me, you are making a lot of judgements about my 'position.' I worked at McDonalds for 2 years so I could afford Uni, it's not exactly an upper class white privileged job.

White privilege is not the same as economic or class privilege. Do you know what white privilege is, or are you making assumptions?
If a black man were rich, then he would have economic privilege over you. But you would still have white privilege over him.
White privilege does not mean that you are racist, or a bad person, or that you should feel guilt, or even that you are well-off in any way. It is understanding that you are in a position where you cannot understand the plight of another, because you can never be in their position.

We put in so many resources for translation of material, when we could easily be putting a lot more into learning English. 'Enough' is just enough to basically say hello, buy things in a shop, etc. I don't expect everyone to be fluent, English is a tough language to learn. I just think it's a gesture of politeness to try and learn the language of the country you are going to live in. Obviously that isn't possible for everyone if the resources aren't there, but the number of free English language courses around leaves little excuse to just try and learn a bit. I know people that have been here for 20 years and barely know how to greet me... I'm not sure how that happens.

Fair enough. I can understand why you say that now.
I've just known a lot of people who think anything less that perfectly fluent isn't 'good enough'. I didn't mean to insinuate anything.

I would like to state that I am not denying you have struggles, MissMisa.
Simply that discrimination and racism are different, and I do not believe that in a society where 'whiteness' is valued above other ethnicities, you can be racist towards white people.