Japanese Only!

[hennaz]

Last time I went to Japan, I did not see any signs saying "Japanese only" at all. But I am very concerned about discrimination against foreigners there, because there are foreigners who DO know at least a fair a level of Japanese, who ARE aware of bathing etiquette etc., who love Japan, and want to integrate within the Japanese culture, who want to go to/dine/party etc. at places where the local Japanese go to. This includes the onsen. While I can understand why there are separate onsen for Japanese and foreigners, I am personally against that, because tourists with the attitude above want to bathe in the same onsen as the Japanese.
There is a naturalised Japanese citizen of American descent called Arudou Debito, who compaigns for foreigner's rights in Japan. Try Googling his name, or looking it up in Wikipedia.
Debito Arudou - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[MMM]

Originally Posted by hennaz

Last time I went to Japan, I did not see any signs saying "Japanese only" at all. But I am very concerned about discrimination against foreigners there, because there are foreigners who DO know at least a fair a level of Japanese, who ARE aware of bathing etiquette etc., who love Japan, and want to integrate within the Japanese culture, who want to go to/dine/party etc. at places where the local Japanese go to. This includes the onsen. While I can understand why there are separate onsen for Japanese and foreigners, I am personally against that, because tourists with the attitude above want to bathe in the same onsen as the Japanese.
There is a naturalised Japanese citizen of American descent called Arudou Debito, who compaigns for foreigner's rights in Japan. Try Googling his name, or looking it up in Wikipedia.
Debito Arudou - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Separate onsen for foreigners? Never heard of that before. All the onsen I went to were "integrated". Can you send a link about that? Be sure that is far from the norm. I have always been welcomed everywhere I wanted to dine/party/etc. If you are very concerned, I think you are too concerned.

Take what Debito Arudou says with a grain of salt. He makes a living complaining and making a lot of noise. His is one opinion, but I would be careful about treating it like gospel.

[xyzone]

Yeah, I think Mr. Debito should just take baths at home.

[MurakamiKitsune]

Originally Posted by kawaiine

do you think that maybe its just like america in ways how
people here are aganst people from mexico and stuff coming over here :/
i mean i might get yelled at or something but we are all the same in thinking about people right? DX for some reason people are just mre o.o about it if its not with our country it seems
im from japan and im half white half japanese
its still hard there
i mean i wouldnt say that they are against white people
but they just think that they were brought up there it should be only them who live there
or osmething
i most likely make no sence but i tryed
sorry

I think I get what you mean. (Sorry for jumping into a conversation like this) But it's not that Americans don't like Mexicans, it's just that there are so few jobs that we can't aford to have people crossing the borders to take jobs Americans could of had. Just like the one who started this forum was saying about the Japanese, but America is so 'lax' about who they hire, some buisnesses would hire the foreigner despite weather it's good buisness or not because they're afraid of being accused of racisum weather it is racisum or not.
(Mind you not every one shares my views... WAY too many Americans are racist towards Mexicans... I personaly don't mind oogling at a hot latino foreigner with a sexy accent. Even if I don't get a word they are saying. )

I would still like to visit Japan some day! I already knew some of this stuff about being polit and everything, if any one knows of a good site that could give me pointers or teach me how to be polit I would greatly apreciate it. I would hate to insult some one, I fret over insulting some one even here in America, it's so easy for some one to missunderstand some one else with our language.

[ozkai]

Originally Posted by hennaz

Last time I went to Japan, I did not see any signs saying "Japanese only" at all. But I am very concerned about discrimination against foreigners there, because there are foreigners who DO know at least a fair a level of Japanese, who ARE aware of bathing etiquette etc., who love Japan, and want to integrate within the Japanese culture, who want to go to/dine/party etc. at places where the local Japanese go to. This includes the onsen. While I can understand why there are separate onsen for Japanese and foreigners, I am personally against that, because tourists with the attitude above want to bathe in the same onsen as the Japanese.
There is a naturalised Japanese citizen of American descent called Arudou Debito, who compaigns for foreigner's rights in Japan. Try Googling his name, or looking it up in Wikipedia.
Debito Arudou - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I believe the "No foreigner" signs are really intended for one race of people and that's Russians.

You can't blame em as Russian fisherman in Japan have a pretty bad image of being noisy, messy and careless whilst drunk in Onsens.

the problem is, ALL foreigners feel a sense of togetherness afforded by growing up within stereo cultures and countries.

Japan is just so mono culture and inexperienced with the wider cultures.

[eako]

Yah so. If a none Japanese person can speak japanese fluently, read it and speak it well and such. And was familiar with customs ect. Can they go into a place with "Japanese only"?

If they blend into Japanese society like average Japanese person, can they go to places such as those? If they live in Japan for a long time and they are married to a Japanese person and they have japanese passport, can they go into places with signs?

[Nagoyankee]

Originally Posted by eako

Yah so. If a none Japanese person can speak japanese fluently, read it and speak it well and such. And was familiar with customs ect. Can they go into a place with "Japanese only"?

If they blend into Japanese society like average Japanese person, can they go to places such as those? If they live in Japan for a long time and they are married to a Japanese person and they have japanese passport, can they go into places with signs?

Eako, don't let some of the less-informed posters here mislead you. Read MMM's posts carefully.

You DON'T want to go into those places. The average Japanese person doesn't go to them. I don't go to them. Why spend a whole week's pay on a drink or two even if your ugly hostess might let you touch her boobs? She will drink three times as much as you and you are the one required to pay for them.

You miss absolutely nothing by not entering these suspicious businesses. Take it from the oldest, if not the wisest, Japanese member here.

[Nyororin]

Debito prides himself on hunting down "discrimination". LOOKING for it constantly, and travelling around Japan to make a huge deal out of the smallest issues.
Are there problems in Japan? Yes. But having a sign up on a pay 100,000yen for a chance to grope shop is hardly worth wasting breath on. (Especially when it seems to be pretty common for foreign guys to try to get out of paying by citing ignorance of the prices or go crazy breaking the rules.)

If you search for discrimination, I`m sure you`ll be able to find it. But I`m almost 100% certain if you search for discrimination in your home country, and interpret anything negative toward you as being based on some sort of racism... There will be plenty to find. If you expect to be discriminated against, you will believe you are - regardless of the reality.

I have honestly been here 10 years, and the worst "discrimination" I experience is the common assumption that I probably don`t speak Japanese. (Resulting in attempts to communicate in English, or slow clear Japanese.)

But it`s very hard to blame anyone for that as it seems that the great majority of foreigners in Japan really CAN`T speak Japanese, regardless of whether they`re tourists or long term residents. (Nothing offensive intended, but just take a look around on here. We have users who were in Japan 5+ years who can`t manage even elementary level conversation...) Foreigners in Japan who CAN speak Japanese well are an extreme minority. I get much much more discrimination from other foreigners in Japan for that ability than I have ever gotten from any Japanese national.

[DJnohara]

When I was in Japan I didn't see a single one of those signs, and I was never denied access to some place because of my nationality.
For the record, I heard those signs were technically made illegal 15 years ago, and you can report them to the authorities as discrimination? At least that's what I read.

[Ryzorian]

Probably depends on what they mean by "Japanese", Someone born there would certainly be "culturally" Japanese but wouldn't have to be racially "Japanese". So what's the distinction?

That's why I think being American isn't anything about race so much as "Belief", Americanism is kinda like a relgion in some reguards, wich is why I never believed American's were born, but rather made.

Japan on the other hand, has been "racially" Japanese for millinia, so it's simply a natural order of things for them. While the US has been a hoge podge pretty much from it's birth. The two nations are practically exact oppisites in many ways. This difference might be what causes much of the frustrations.