The origins of Japanese tea-drinking?

[annelie82]

I'm not sure where this topic belongs, but anyway.

I've just learned that tea is "o-cha" in Japanese. Perhaps not so incidentally, tea in Portuguese is "chá" - I read somewhere that Portuguese merchants and missionaries carried out expeditions to Japan around the 17th-18th(?) Centuries.
I guess what I'm trying to ask is: to what extent is Japan's tea tradition imported (from Portugal) and to what extent has it been cultivated by the Japanese themselves?

Any information on this topic is much appreciated.

~annelie

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by annelie82

I'm not sure where this topic belongs, but anyway.

I've just learned that tea is "o-cha" in Japanese. Perhaps not so incidentally, tea in Portuguese is "chá" - I read somewhere that Portuguese merchants and missionaries carried out expeditions to Japan around the 17th-18th(?) Centuries.
I guess what I'm trying to ask is: to what extent is Japan's tea tradition imported (from Portugal) and to what extent has it been cultivated by the Japanese themselves?

Any information on this topic is much appreciated.

~annelie

In this case, it`s the other way around. Tea was *exported* to Portugal.
Tea in Japan came to be via China, and tea drinking (and eating of tea leaves) has been practiced in Asia since ancient times. In Japan, there are records of tea being consumed prior to the 9th century.

Tea drinking in Europe is actually a fairly recent thing - it was brought to Europe in the mid 16th century, most likely by the Portuguese.

As for the word for tea - there are two different forms which have spread around the world, both derived from Chinese dialects. One being "tea" and the other being "cha". Most modern languages used a word derived from one of those two bases.

[annelie82]

Wow, thanks for the info, I appreciate it!

~annelie

[maitrekong]

it's very interesting really thanks very much

[samokan]

In ancient times also in Japan, tea ( high quality) was/can only be consumed by the rich people. So to prevent them from getting assinated, gold was laid in the bottom of the tea container, this way if the color change, as gold reacts with chemicals, they know that the tea had been tampered.

[annelie82]

Wow, interesting piece of info, thank you! Who would've thought that gold could be used for that purpose? Is that why the Japanese don't put milk in their tea, I wonder? Because any change of colour would have been more difficult to detect as it would have been "obscured" by the milk?

~annelie

[bleedingboy]

tea comes from china. almost all of japan's culture was rooted from china. ideas are often stolen from another, and improved by one.

in china tea is also cha. in philippines we did the same thing we just repeated the last vowel. chaa or tsaa.

most of our words are repeated. like. kili-kili [armpit]

if you're filipino. and you're a kid. your name would probably be nene. nini.

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by annelie82

Wow, interesting piece of info, thank you! Who would've thought that gold could be used for that purpose? Is that why the Japanese don't put milk in their tea, I wonder? Because any change of colour would have been more difficult to detect as it would have been "obscured" by the milk?

~annelie

I think that is mainly because the whole culture of tea is significantly different in Japan to begin with. Tea is *not* sweetened, and one of the main points is to enjoy the pure flavor of it. Putting milk into the tea for one thing wouldn`t go along with the flavor, and for another would obscure the flavor.

Besides, milk really wasn`t normally consumed in Japan anyway.

The detection by gold bit really isn`t at all unique to Japan - it was used is Europe also. It isn`t something the average person would do, so I seriously doubt it would have a big influence on the general styles of consuming tea.

[annelie82]

Originally Posted by bleedingboy

tea comes from china. almost all of japan's culture was rooted from china. ideas are often stolen from another, and improved by one.

I've heard that Japanese culture derives from Korean culture as well. Supposedly the question of Japanese cultural origin is often the cause of a major identity crisis for Japanese people - they don't like to be thought of as the 'offspring' of other cultures, apparently. At least not on the expense of their present-day cultural uniqueness/individuality.

most of our words are repeated. like. kili-kili [armpit]

I've read about this somewhere. Do you do this with all your words, or just with certain word categories, like nouns? What happens if you say just "kili" instead of "kili-kili"? Will people still understand you?

~annelie

[annelie82]

Originally Posted by Nyororin

I think that is mainly because the whole culture of tea is significantly different in Japan to begin with. Tea is *not* sweetened, and one of the main points is to enjoy the pure flavor of it. Putting milk into the tea for one thing wouldn`t go along with the flavor, and for another would obscure the flavor.

Besides, milk really wasn`t normally consumed in Japan anyway.

Ah, I see. What's present-day tea consumption in Japan like, then? Is green tea still the predominant type, or do Japanese people drink black (roasted) tea as well?

~annelie