What is the form of 持つんだ

[Yuukigami]

I wouldn't recommend thinking of 持つんだ as a command. It literally means "it is the thing that (someone) carries". It is for explanation. Although in certain contexts it can seem like a command. Similar to how んじゃない in certain cases can indicate some sort of negative command. But think of it literally, これを持つんだ。"It is that (you) carry this" That can be taken as explanation or some sort of a command, or more like...I don't know what the right word for it is. lol I would just look at it as explanation because it makes sense either way, at least to me.

Similarly, something like 調子に乗ってんじゃないよ！Literally means something like "It isn't the thing that you are full of yourself!" (調子に乗る＝(lit.)To ride a tone, mood, manner(there are a ton of English translations for 調子).

It is a bit hard to understand but it is better to look at Japanese literally and avoid "pretty" English, it makes more sense after a while. Try to avoid English translations as a whole when it comes to Japanese.

[KyleGoetz]

Originally Posted by yuriyuri

I beg to differ, but I won't argue.
(Just to clarify, I don't even like anime, the only examples I could find were mainly anime though )

But either way, when it comes down to it, it's still grammar, and if you want to understand, it must still be learned whether you use it in daily speech or not.
(I'm just assuming that you say not to really use it because of it not really being used in real life conversations, sorry if I'm wrong)

People in anime use a lot of words and constructions you won't encounter in real life. Plus, you will sound weird repeating their schtick. I've encountered guys talking like Akane Tendo. That was messed up.

[lucagalbu]

Wow.. It's harder than I thought
So, let me change the question this way: if someone told you "well, how do you say "if you want to be a hero, hold your dreams" in Japanese?", what would be your answer?
Is it something like: "英雄になりたければ、夢を持って"?

[Yuukigami]

Yes that sentence is correct.

According to a page in, 現代日本語文法概説, のだ can be considered a command. But the problem is のだ is also used for explanation and showing a reason ect. To me it makes sense to think of it literally but whatever way works for you.

Here is a J-J entry for のだ　

1)原因・理由・根拠などの説明を強く述べる。
o 「こうして独り住まいをしていると、ますます孤立感が 深まっていく―だ」
o 「弟の言うことを聞けば聞くほど、気の毒でしかたがな かった―だ」
(2)意志的な動作を表す語に付いて、その動作主の決意や 相手に対する要求などを表す。
「なんとしても、この事だけは達成する―だ」
「早くここから出て行くんだ」
(3)（「のだった」の形で）事態の説明をやや詠嘆的に言 い表す。
o 「一人思い出にふける―だった」

If you are confused even more, sorry! Just to make it easy I guess you can think of it as a command in certain contexts. By the way, there are A LOT of ways to show a command or some sort of command in Japanese, so be aware of that.

[komitsuki]

Originally Posted by yuriyuri

Here is an example I found though.
I seem to mainly hear it in TV, Games and Movies and stuff so I have no idea how often it's used in real life.

Go to 3:17
He says, 「ごはん　逃げるんだっ！」

Watched it and I still don't think it is a command form because it still emphasize on convincing (not commanding) in this clip, as -nda is a way to lead unexpressed context. Unexpressed context in this clip's situation is the way for the sake of convincing someone.

Also, convincing and commanding can sometimes be blurred by translation.

As Inigo Montoya would say: "I do not think it means what you think it means."

[Yuukigami]

逃げるんだ IS a statement no matter how you look at it. In this case he is telling ごはん that he WILL escape. (lit.)"It is the thing that you escape!". That's why I wouldn't think of it as a flat out command, but if you choose to I guess you can. Although, be careful because context is very important. And because のだ is used for explanation, to show reason ect.

[komitsuki]

Originally Posted by Yuukigami

逃げるんだ IS a statement no matter how you look at it..

Yes. I may said that it is emphasizing a statement of indicating a unexpressed context that is to convince a person. Your explanation is simple and better to understand. Oh, snap!

Originally Posted by Yuukigami

That's why I wouldn't think of it as a flat out command, but if you choose to I guess you can..

Translations can be a hazardous thing to do.

For example: in Classical Sanskrit (梵語;古代インドの文語) a modal sentence of doing something necessary "you must do this" is exactly same as saying a command "(you) do this" if you look at in the English or other perspectives. Though this is only towards a second person entity. And people have trouble translating this case in many languages from Sanskrit.

This is just one example. Sometimes lazy translation is the cause of many misconception.

[Yuukigami]

Originally Posted by komitsuki

Yes. I may said that it is emphasizing a statement of indicating a unexpressed context that is to convince a person. Your explanation is simple and better to understand. Oh, snap!



Translations can be a hazardous thing to do.

For example: in Classical Sanskrit (梵語;古代インドの文語) a modal sentence of doing something necessary "you must do this" is exactly same as saying a command "(you) do this" if you look at in the English or other perspectives. Though this is only towards a second person entity. And people have trouble translating this case in many languages from Sanskrit.

This is just one example. Sometimes lazy translation is the cause of many misconception.

I completely agree. I HATE English translations when it comes to Japanese. I only use them when I am explaining something to someone else, and 99.9% of the time they are literal translations because it helps one become accustomed to the Japanese way of thought. English just makes things more confusing once you get deep into the language. That's why I use J-J dictionaries.

[hirashin]

Originally Posted by lucagalbu

Wow.. It's harder than I thought
So, let me change the question this way: if someone told you "well, how do you say "if you want to be a hero, hold your dreams" in Japanese?", what would be your answer?
Is it something like: "英雄になりたければ、夢を持って"?

夢を持って sounds very soft. I feel it would not fit in this case.　I think 英雄になりたければ夢を持て, 夢を持とう, 夢を持つんだ etc. would be better.

夢を持つんだ and 逃げるんだ are commands.

ごはん、逃げるんだ！ is almost the same as ごはん、逃げろ！

Hope it helps.

ひらしん　(a native Japanese speaker)

[BenjaminJapan]

To answer your original question, because I'm not sure anyway did, 持つ is the plain dictionary form. This is the most basic form of the verb.

Verbs before んだ take casual form, so that could be 持つ、持った、持たない、持たなかった、持っている、 持っていた、持っていない、持っていなかった、etc.

There's a lot you can learn from anime that you can't learn from novels or textbooks, and there's a lot to learn in novels and textbooks that you'll never learn in anime. The point is that you understand the difference between anime Japanese, casual Japanese, polite Japanese, and extra-polite Japanese. I wouldn't recommend ever trying to speak the first one.