Request for list of common Japanese food words

[jbradfor]

I'm looking for a list (in some flashcard format preferred, but not required) of the most common 100-250 food words found on menus in Japan. But not in Romanji, I want them in Kanji/Hiragana/Katakana (whichever is commonly used for that word) so I can read them on a menu.

I've looked for such a list here and using google, but to no avail. I've found many lists, but they are in Romanji. Wikipedia has a fairly extensive listing, but the Kanji/Hiragana/Katakana are typically available only by following links and hence it will take a long time to generate a list.

Can anyone one point me to such a list? Or any other suggestions?

[In case you're wondering why, we're probably heading to Japan in a couple of months. I've set myself a modest-but-I-hope-achievable goal to learn Hiragana, Katakana, and about 100 food words before I go. Thanks to other posts here I've found some great Hiragana and Katakana resources, but nothing yet on common food words.]

[Columbine]

There's something of a list here: 4Japan.Info - Japanese Food Glossary which is mostly all traditional izukaya/ resturant foods. It's probably not exactly the best list you'd want as a tourist, but it's got some useful words on it.

[CityofTrees]

You know, I'd almost recommend learning the most common kanji found in food rather than entire food names since you're doing sort of a crash course. When I lived there, my first few months of eating out involved such detective work before I learned more.

For example, it's not likely you'll be able to memorize 200 long phrases if you've never studied kanji before, like 揚げ出し豆腐, but if you learn 豆 is bean, or that bean followed by something hideously complicated (腐) is "tofu", then you'll have a basic idea of what you're ordering. (The long one is agedashidoufu, deliciously fried tofu served with a yummy sauce).

I would sit down and think of a list of very basic food ideas in English and then go look them up in Japanese and make flash cards. More examples:

肉 - niku, meat in general or sometimes beef specifically
鳥 - tori, bird but usually means chicken in terms of food
牛 - gyuu - beef
卵 - tamago - egg
魚 - sakana - fish
野菜 - yasai - vegetables
そば - soba
うどん -udon
酒 - sake - Japanese sake or sometimes alcohol in general
丼　- don, "bowl", as in a bowl of rice with stuff on top, like 牛丼
飲み物 - nomimono - drink
食べ物 - tabemono - food

And two long but magical phrases, worth memorizing:

食べ放題 - tabehoudai
のも放題 -nomihoudai

All you can eat or all you can drink, respectively, for a set period of time, ordering off a set menu.

Good luck and enjoy your trip!

[jbradfor]

@columbine: thanks for the list. That's not too far from what I was looking for, and it's already in table format, so it should be pretty easy to parse out into a format for a flash card program.

@CityofTrees: I meant to mention in my first posting that I'm studying Chinese and know about 1500 characters. I realize that kanji is not quite the same as Chinese (e.g. some characters are written differently, many characters have different meanings), but I don't fear kanji I was surprised, however, to see that much kanji in food words. In my previous (and only) trip to Japan, I was expecting to have some vague idea of menus by reading the kanji. However, I was very disappointed and surprised to find almost no kanji on the menus. Does this not match other peoples' experience?

[Columbine]

Originally Posted by jbradfor

@columbine: thanks for the list. That's not too far from what I was looking for, and it's already in table format, so it should be pretty easy to parse out into a format for a flash card program.

@CityofTrees: I meant to mention in my first posting that I'm studying Chinese and know about 1500 characters. I realize that kanji is not quite the same as Chinese (e.g. some characters are written differently, many characters have different meanings), but I don't fear kanji I was surprised, however, to see that much kanji in food words. In my previous (and only) trip to Japan, I was expecting to have some vague idea of menus by reading the kanji. However, I was very disappointed and surprised to find almost no kanji on the menus. Does this not match other peoples' experience?

No that's pretty standard to find menu's without lots and lots of kanji. Don't forget, there are people in Japan who struggle with them, and school kids who haven't learnt them all so excepting very traditional high-end restaurants, most provide simple kanji and hiragana to make life easier. You might also want to learn katakana as things like drinks (coffee and non-sake alcohols for example) are often listed in 'kana.

[CityofTrees]

Well, man, I feel like a chump having written all that out. Usually, in my experience, folks just getting started in kana have never seen kanji of any kind before. Doh!

I lived in Japan for five years and ran across plenty of kanji in my time in restaurants, but if in your experience if you found only hiragana and katakana names, why not just use the romaji lists you've found and figure out/copy down the appropriate kana? For example, if you see "yakisoba" you know it'll be やきそば at a kanji-less level. Foreign dishes/beverages will be in katakana: "beer": ビール.

[jbradfor]

Originally Posted by CityofTrees

Well, man, I feel like a chump having written all that out. Usually, in my experience, folks just getting started in kana have never seen kanji of any kind before. Doh!

Now you've made me feel guilty! Sorry for not mentioning that earlier.

Take heart, however, that list of kanji was pretty useful to me. For example, I know 鳥, but I don't think one would see that on a Chinese menu, one would see 雞 instead, so now I know to keep an eye out for that. Similarly, one doesn't see 卵 on Chinese menus, 蛋 is used instead. And rather than 丼, 碗 is used. So I already learned some important differences!

And, most importantly, 放題! I'm not even sure how to say "all you can eat" in Chinese (although I can say buffet), but now I do in Japanese!

So thanks.

Originally Posted by CityofTrees

I lived in Japan for five years and ran across plenty of kanji in my time in restaurants, but if in your experience if you found only hiragana and katakana names, why not just use the romaji lists you've found and figure out/copy down the appropriate kana? For example, if you see "yakisoba" you know it'll be やきそば at a kanji-less level. Foreign dishes/beverages will be in katakana: "beer": ビール.

Because doing so involves a lot of work And I am surprised that such vocab lists don't already exist.

Seriously, now that I've started to learn kana, I realize that won't be as hard as I feared, so I just might. Learning kana is not that bad. Not as easy as Hungul, but not too bad.

[CityofTrees]

Aww, no, I'm sorry! I just like to ramble, so it's easy for me to write a lot. >_>

And yes, houdai is a glorious word though I realize my autofill in Japanese didn't do the kanji right for nomihoudai: 飲み放題 is the sign you want to keep an eye out for, not のみ放題. There's also the English-borrowed "Viking", which for some reason means buffet as well.

Think of it as practice, regarding the kana, if you decide to do it! I'll even spotcheck it for you, if you, like, once you're finished.

And, on a random note, if you don't mind me asking... I once heard that while 手紙 is "letter" in Japanese (which I know), I heard the same characters are "toilet paper" in Chinese. Is that true?

[jbradfor]

Originally Posted by CityofTrees

And, on a random note, if you don't mind me asking... I once heard that while 手紙 is "letter" in Japanese (which I know), I heard the same characters are "toilet paper" in Chinese. Is that true?

You know, now that you mention it, I don't even know how to say "toilet paper" in Chinese. I try to bring my own when traveling there so the issue never came up

According to MDBG (popular online Chinese dictionary), it's "衛生紙". While it's possible that it's a regional and/or slang that hasn't made it in yet, a search on google images shows only letters, no toilet paper. Humm, limiting the search to Taiwan shows some pictures of what I think are paper towels, not toilet paper. So that may be the answer, it's a Taiwan name for paper towels, doesn't seem to be called that in China.

[Columbine]

Originally Posted by CityofTrees

There's also the English-borrowed "Viking", which for some reason means buffet as well.

Oh, I asked about this once; apparently it's supposed to be "Smörgåsbord" (swedish buffet) but that was just too difficult for Japanese people to pronounce/remember so they just changed it to 'Viking'.

As for kanji on menu's, I think the worst (or most inconvenient for those of limited kanji) I ever saw was 麦飲 for 'beer'. The whole menu was like that. Like a kind of cryptic kanji crossword.