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03-08-2011, 12:29 AM

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Originally Posted by KyleGoetz View Post
次の「限定」という課についての質問がありますが...

まず、「に限り」と「に限って」はどう違いますか。

次に、『信頼や特別な期待をもって話題にし、「その人 だけは好ましくないことはしないはずだ」と推量する時 に使う。』は英語でなんと言いますか。Used when guessing, with a topic that contains a special expectation or belief, "Only to that person must that unwanted thing not occur"は?その英語も理解できません。やはりへたなほん やくでしょう。

お教えになってください。
「~~に限り」と「~~に限って」は意味は同じです。 後者がよりインフォーマルで口語的な表現になります。

『信頼や特別な期待をもって話題にし、「その人 だけは好ましくないことはしないはずだ」と推量する時 に使う。』の意味は、

"Used when making an inference about a person whom you regard with a special trust or expectation and saying 'that s/he will be the last person to do an undesirable or disagreeable thing.'" 

お教えになってください, BTW, doesn't mean what you appear to have thought it meant. You can only say it when the teacher is not teaching (e.g. for sleeping, kidding around, etc.) or somehow is refusing to teach.

You could have simply said お教えください or 教えてください.

Last edited by masaegu : 03-08-2011 at 08:24 AM.
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03-08-2011, 05:43 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by masaegu View Post
「~~に限り」と「~~に限って」は意味は同じです。 後者がよりインフォーマルで口語的な表現になります。

『信頼や特別な期待をもって話題にし、「その人 だけは好ましくないことはしないはずだ」と推量する時 に使う。』の意味は、

"Used when making an inference about a person whom you regard with a special trust or expectation and saying 'that s/he will be the last person to do an undesirable or disagreeable thing.'" 

お教えになってください, BTW, doesn't mean what you appear to have thought it meant. You can only say it when the teacher is not teaching (e.g. for sleeping, kidding around, etc.) or somehow is refusing to teach.

You could have simply said お教えください or 教えてください.
Got it. Thank you!
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04-21-2011, 08:33 PM

Just curious how this could be rendered in English: 「いつもの〜、通常の〜ではなく」と言いたい時に使う 。

I'm working on translating the section on 比較・最上級・対比 in that same grammar book of mine. Right now I'm trying to understand the usage of 〜にかわって. The book's relevant passage says:

Quote:
〜にかわって【〜ではなく】
「いつもの〜、通常の〜ではなく」と言いたい時に使う 。
I think it's just saying it's used when you want to say "The typical thing is ~, not the ordinary ~."

Thanks!
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04-22-2011, 02:29 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by KyleGoetz View Post
Just curious how this could be rendered in English: 「いつもの〜、通常の〜ではなく」と言いたい時に使う 。

I'm working on translating the section on 比較・最上級・対比 in that same grammar book of mine. Right now I'm trying to understand the usage of 〜にかわって. The book's relevant passage says:

I think it's just saying it's used when you want to say "The typical thing is ~, not the ordinary ~."

Thanks!
I think you are reading the structure of the phrase inside the 「」 wrong.
It is saying 「いつもの〜ではなく、通常の〜ではなく」,

An English translation would be:
'Used when wanting to say "instead of the usual or regular ~~"'


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04-22-2011, 03:12 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by masaegu View Post
I think you are reading the structure of the phrase inside the 「」 wrong.
It is saying 「いつもの〜ではなく、通常の〜ではなく」,

An English translation would be:
'Used when wanting to say "instead of the usual or regular ~~"'
Thank you. It seems painfully obvious in retrospect!
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07-16-2011, 04:37 AM

New question!

I have no idea where I could have researched this grammar structure to learn about it, and I just can't figure it out.

一分間も早く、町の病院へはこんでやらねばならない。
What in the world is that 一分間も早く doing there? "We must transport her to the city's hospital." It seems the 一分間も早く obviously operates as something about the time frame, but does it mean "every second counts," or "we can't wait one more minute" or "it's only one more minute until we reach there" or what? "Even if we get there a minute early [before the hospital opens], we must..."?

What structure is this? 【期間】も【形容詞】? How is it used?

Later on, I come across a similar usage of 一秒間も争う人. 【期間】も〜.

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07-16-2011, 05:13 AM

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Originally Posted by KyleGoetz View Post
New question!

I have no idea where I could have researched this grammar structure to learn about it, and I just can't figure it out.

一分間も早く、町の病院へはこんでやらねばならない。
What in the world is that 一分間も早く doing there? "We must transport her to the city's hospital." It seems the 一分間も早く obviously operates as something about the time frame, but does it mean "every second counts," or "we can't wait one more minute" or "it's only one more minute until we reach there" or what? "Even if we get there a minute early [before the hospital opens], we must..."?

What structure is this? 【期間】も【形容詞】? How is it used?

Later on, I come across a similar usage of 一秒間も争う人. 【期間】も〜.
一分間も早く in standard Japanese would be 一分でも早く, which is still rarely understood by Japanese-learners. It means "as soon as possible". Literally it says "even a minute early".

This でも is a particle and it is different from the conjunctin でも that means "but".

【期間】も【形容詞】 = as (adjective) as possible with an emphasis that every (time frame) counts. As I said above, it most often takes the form of 【期間】でも【形容詞】

一週間でも長く日本にいたい。 (Said by someone who has been staying in Japan over a few months.)
一日でも長く生きたい。
一時間でも早くこの戦争が終わってほしい。
一円でも多く稼ぎたい。
死ぬまでに一本でも多くビールを飲みたい。

Try forming some phrases using the structure and you will get the hang of it.

Finally, 一秒間も争う人 is a bit different in that 争う is a verb. It means a person who is on a second-by-second schedule, which is usually an overstatement. 争う = competing (with time)


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07-16-2011, 12:28 PM

Thanks! In this case, the woman has typhus (which, I have learned, was once a 法定伝染病, but recently the law has changed so that this phrase only refers to certain animal diseases), so she is on a second-by-second schedule, competing with time!

Having to deal with not only a new accent, but also older Japanese, has been fun (but vexing).

A couple of attempts on my part:

飲みほうだいだから、1時間でも長く店にいたい。
12月には司法試験なので、1日でも長く勉強しておき ますよ。
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07-19-2011, 05:47 AM

Just thought I'd run my attempt to understand a sentence by JF!

頭にきたのは、この細君が、江戸っ子でしゃきしゃきし ているところへむけて、子供二人が、何やかや、食料の ことや遊び場のことなどで、農家の未亡人とウマがあわ ず、日頃から口もきかない間柄になってしまっていたこ とである。

Basically, this sentence says that the wife and children did not get along with the farmer's widow, regularly went days without speaking, this upset the speaker, and the chief causes were that (1) the wife was a Tokyoite so lived in a brisk/efficient/fast-paced manner and (2) there were problems with the two children and their food and space for playing.

Right?

The hardest part was probably understanding the 農家の未亡人とウマがあわず part. It was only by accident, reading an entry in a Japanese dictionary for 合う, that I found out that 馬が合う is a set phrase.

Thanks!
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07-19-2011, 05:55 AM

That is correct to a T.


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