berrypie's Japanese learning thread :)

[berrypie]

みなさん、こんにちは！
ベリーパイです。

As I continue my self-study on Japanese, I have more and more questions in my head. Instead of posting my questions in that big question thread, I'd like to have my own one so that I can trace what I have learned. (because sometime I can't jot it down into my notebook immediately)

そういうわけで、よろしくお願いしますね！

Thanks a lot in advance

Here is my first question: what does 済む mean? I only know it means something like "to end" or "to complete". I don't know what it exactly means especially when it's attached after a negative て-form.

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by berrypie

Here is my first question: what does 済む mean? I only know it means something like "to end" or "to complete". I don't know what it exactly means especially when it's attached after a negative て-form.

I'm assuming that you're referring to phrases like しなくて済む, 行かなくて済む, etc.

This 済む means that:
you succeed without having to do something
you solve (a problem) without having to do something
you manage without doing something

Hope I'm talking about the 済む that you are talking about.

[berrypie]

Hmm.... so what does すみません literally means?

行かなくて済
I cannot make an example sentence yet, as I haven't completely understood what it means here. To me it means something like "have something done without going to somewhere" or "achieve something without going", is it correct?

I am doing a bit reading before sleep. Here is a sentence I don't quite understand: (from "the little prince")

だけれど、ぼくたちは、ものそのもの、ことそのことが、たいせつですから、もちろん、番号なんか、どうで もいいのです。

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by berrypie

Hmm.... so what does すみません literally means?

Literally, it means "something doesn't end (well)" or "something is not completed". BUT it isn't often used for its literal meaning. As you know, we mostly say it to mean "I'm sorry."

I guess you can see the connectin there. Something didn't go as well as planned, so you are apologizing.

行かなくて済
I cannot make an example sentence yet, as I haven't completely understood what it means here. To me it means something like "have something done without going to somewhere" or "achieve something without going", is it correct?

Correct. You were originally planning on going someplace, but something happened and it saved you the action　of going. Let me give you some examples:

父がおすしをたくさん持ってきてくれたので、晩ご飯を 作らずに済んだ。
東京は電車やバスの路線が多いので、車を運転しなくて 済みます。
宝くじが当たったので、一生働かずに済む！
雪で授業がキャンセルされたので、テストを受けずに済 んだ。

I am doing a bit reading before sleep. Here is a sentence I don't quite understand: (from "the little prince")

だけれど、ぼくたちは、ものそのもの、ことそのことが、たいせつですから、もちろん、番号なんか、どうで もいいのです。

It's saying that things themselves are important, not the numbers (or perhaps names). In other words, it's saying that what counts is the content, not the looks.

[berrypie]

うん...じゃ、「ものそのもの、ことそのこと」って、ど ういう意味ですか？To me it sounds like "this and that"

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by berrypie

うん...じゃ、「ものそのもの、ことそのこと」って、ど ういう意味ですか？To me it sounds like "this and that"

No. It doesn't mean "this and that".

ものそのもの　＝　物の本質(tangible things)
ことそのこと　＝　事の本質(intangible things)

これなら分かるでしょう？

[berrypie]

Originally Posted by Sashimister

No. It doesn't mean "this and that".

ものそのもの　＝　物の本質(tangible things)
ことそのこと　＝　事の本質(intangible things)

これなら分かるでしょう？

うん... (staring at the phrase for 30 sec) I can't even guess what it means! lol. It seems that dictionary doesn't have this phrase so I totally don't understand. Now, the sentence perfectly makes sense to me.

さて、次の質問をさせていただきます。
「待つって、なにをさ」
「日が沈むまで待つのさ」
I only know an i-adjective can become a noun by attaching さ at the end (and drop the い off), how does it sound like when it is used as a sentence copula?

[kirakira]

Originally Posted by berrypie

さて、次の質問をさせていただきます。
「待つって、なにをさ」
「日が沈むまで待つのさ」
I only know an i-adjective can become a noun by attaching さ at the end (and drop the い off), how does it sound like when it is used as a sentence copula?

No this is a different さ(終助詞) and is added to the END of a sentence similar to の、か etc. It emphasises that sentence, doesn't have much meaning on it's own (like many things in Japanese).

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by berrypie

うん... (staring at the phrase for 30 sec) I can't even guess what it means! lol. It seems that dictionary doesn't have this phrase so I totally don't understand. Now, the sentence perfectly makes sense to me.

I don't know what the context is but it just means the essentials of a thing, the core, the heart, the nature, etc. If you know what 本質 or 核心, you should be able to understand it.

さて、次の質問をさせていただきます。
「待つって、なにをさ」
「日が沈むまで待つのさ」
I only know an i-adjective can become a noun by attaching さ at the end (and drop the い off), how does it sound like when it is used as a sentence copula?

This さ has nothing to do with the adjective nominalizing さ.

It is a masculine sentence-ending particle that is close to よ in meaning but is only softer. さ is very close to だよ in nuance.

[berrypie]

kirakiraさん、答えてくださってありがとうございます！� ��れからもよろしくおねがいしますね！

(Finally someone came and answered my questions other than Sashimister )

Yup I know this さ is different from the one using for i-adjectives. I just don't know how it sounds like.

As Sashimister has already pointed out it's a masculine particle, as a girl I guess I just have to know what it is but not how to use it. :P

東京は電車やバスの路線が多いので、車を運転しなくて 済みます。
宝くじが当たったので、一生働かずに済む！

Sometimes a verb can be negated by using ず and followed by に, how is it different from なくて? Does it sound more formal?

On the other hand, I also see something like "~ないでXXX", how is it different from "~なくてXXX"?

Let me list them out in a tidy way:
...車を運転せずに済みます。
...車を運転しなくて済みます。
...車を運転しないで済みます。

(Am I too annoying?...)