Past tenses

[StueyT]

Hi all,
A quick question regarding past tenses. I've seen Verbs referred to in their usual たform and also in a ~ていました form and was wondering if there was any difference in how/when to use them and if not, which is more commonly used.

For example：
’He forgot his glasses'

彼はめがねを忘れました　/　彼はめがねを忘れた

Or

彼はめがねを忘れていました　/ 彼はめがねを忘れていた

Thanks in advance!　

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by StueyT

Hi all,
A quick question regarding past tenses. I've seen Verbs referred to in their usual たform and also in a ~ていました form and was wondering if there was any difference in how/when to use them and if not, which is more commonly used.

For example：
’He forgot his glasses'

彼はめがねを忘れました　/　彼はめがねを忘れた

Or

彼はめがねを忘れていました　/ 彼はめがねを忘れていた

The two sets of sentences mean very different things from each other.

彼はめがねを忘れました　/　彼はめがねを忘れた means "He left his glasses somewhere." or "He forgot to bring his glasses."

彼はめがねを忘れていました　/ 彼はめがねを忘れていた These you won't hear too often if at all. The only situation I can think of where you might say it is as follows. You are recounting the time when you were watching someone packing for a trip. He told you he was done with the packing. Then you saw his glasses someplace in the room and kindly told him about it. He thanks you and puts the glasses in the bag. Now you're saying to someone, "He was forgetting about his glasses."

[StueyT]

Thanks Sashi.

I didn't actually see that particular verb with the ていました form, in actual fact it was ならべていた　but I cannot remember the sentence it was in. So what you are saying is that it would be used when speaking about something that happened in the past but speaking as if you were actually there right now? Like describing the situation progressively?

Just out of curiousity, how did you get so good at English? If you don't mind asking that is

[Sashimister]

Originally Posted by StueyT

I didn't actually see that particular verb with the ていました form, in actual fact it was ならべていた　but I cannot remember the sentence it was in. So what you are saying is that it would be used when speaking about something that happened in the past but speaking as if you were actually there right now? Like describing the situation progressively?

Just out of curiousity, how did you get so good at English? If you don't mind asking that is

Thing is that 忘れる is not the best verb to study grammar with because there aren't too many tenses you can form with it (at least in Japanese).

Verbs like 食べる、見る、読む are much better and so is ならべる.　With these, you can form the present and past progressive by adding ～～ている/～～ていた, and it means "is (or was) in the middle of ~~ing".　

When you add ～～ている/～～ていた to 忘れる, however, it doesn't form the progressive　because one cannot really be in the middle of forgetting something. 忘れている mostly means "one has forgotten" and 忘れていた, "one had forgotten".

[kirakira]

Originally Posted by StueyT

Thanks Sashi.

I didn't actually see that particular verb with the ていました form, in actual fact it was ならべていた <snip>

Just to get back to basics, ている or てゐる has three functions. One with a English equivalent and the rest which is uniquely Japanese.

The first one is progressive, which is the same as ING in English. 本を読んでいる, READING a book, i.e. the person is in the process of reading the book right now and it is a continuous action. 走っている the person is the process of running. Verbs in this category are generally transitive.

The second one which a lot of Japanese learners gets confused on is a state of being. Exampels includes 忘れる. 忘れている doesn't mean you are in the process of forgetting something, doesn't make sense anyway. What it means is that in the present state, and this state is continuous. I.e. メガネを忘れている means I have forgotten my glasses and still can't remember it right now at this very moment.

結婚している doesn't mean you are in a ceremony this minute, it means you are married and still married now (and not divorced). Put it in the past tense, 結婚していた would imply that the person was married for a period of time in the past but there is no gurantee that that person is married right this moment. Verbs in this category are generally intrasitive.

Confusion kicks into high gear with verbs such as 来る. 来ている does not mean the person is coming, it means the person is already here. 来る in this context means to arrive and in the ている form, means the person has arrived, and is here right now (since the person is in the state of arriving at the final destination this moment and hasn't left).

With Sino-loan words, a lot of times, a verb can be both trasitive and intrasitive, in which case you are pretty much screwed j/k. You just have to deduce from context whether the person is expressing state of being or progressive.

The third use which is a bit less trippy is used to to express an action that is habitual and done regularly such as 私は毎日、新聞を読んでいる. I read the newspaper everyday. Again it does not mean I am reading the newspaper right now, simply that I read the newspaper regularly.

Just make sure you get the basics of grammar first, and read, read and re-read your grammar books over and over until you don't have to think about this stuff anymore. For more info, I'd recommend the book "初級を教える人のための日本語文法ハンドブック". You can get it at Amazon.jp for a reasonable price.

[steven]

Maybe it's a dialect thing but I feel like I would hear people say something like 忘れていた... it's kind of the equivilant to that, but like if someone has forgotten their glasses they have to read something they might say
あら、困ったやな。俺メガネ忘れとった。。。どっか借 りれるやつないけ？

I'm almost positive I've heard stuff like that said before when at the post office or city hall or places like that.　

[KyleGoetz]

Originally Posted by kirakira

Just to get back to basics, ている or てゐる has three functions.

No one uses that second form. ゐ has been deprecated/disallowed/discontinued for many decades.