which is best martial art

[Amnell]

There seem to be a lot of people who want to do or already love doing Aikido. I can't quite figure out why, though, because most other systems with an emphasis on self-defense or combat have teachers that will tell you that Aikido, as it is taught today, is next to useless.

I brought this up with my head instructor last Thursday after our grappling class. I was partnered with someone twice my size and it occured to me that the principles of Aikido would have been handy, and commented as much to my instructor. He told me that the philosophy is great, but the techniques are dated and no longer viable!

(I somewhat disagree with him on the last comment, but he does have a point about their being dated)

I hear this quite frequently. I've heard it so much that I would like to get a lot of experience with a different art like Jujutsu that also uses joint-manipulation and takedowns and then try Aikido. Y'know, get a solid foundation in something that "works" and then get all philosophical.

What do other people hear about Aikido? What makes you want to study it?

The art that I would like to get into next is Arnis/Escrima. I've had lots of exposure to it throughout my life as a martial artist, but never once had it as a focus. I recently learned that there is a school near to where I live, I just don't have the money to go to my current school and this one, also! Suxxorz.

[Amnell]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

Amnell, seriously, shut up. A marine is only good with a rifle in his hands, and even then, the ranges the Americans practice to shoot at are often 60% shorter than other countries, and they still miss the target.

If you want to be good at something you have to practice doing just that. Soldiers are good at shooting. Fighters are good at hand to hand combat.

Being the best marksman in the world does not mean you could fuck over a well trained boxer, even if you are experienced at keeping your cool under pressure - which most boxers are given it is a professional sport.

ROFL @ U

You know what? FUCK you! You obviously don't know jack shit about anything other than your own fucked up little world where everyone other than you and five year old girls are objects to be scorned and hated.

Since you clearly don't know, let me set you straight: The US Marine Corp--not the US Army--trains every soldier to be able to hit a target with a non scoped M16A2 at ranges that the US Army reserves for their 'special' forces that carry scoped M4's and M82's. In order to graduate BCT from the Marines, you have to be able to HIT your targets at least 85% of the time (probably more) at ranges greater than 800 yards. In the Army, the standards are not nearly so tight, so I forgive you if you're simply confused about which branch is which. Marines don't fuck around, though. There's a damn good reason why whenever the UN wants to throw some weight around they send the USMC.

Foot soldiers in general train to fight in whatever circumstances they find themselves: from 200 yards behind a wall with a rifle, or three feet away with a rifle that's out of ammo and a knife. Marines definitely train for these situations. Hell, even you had to have had SOME training for that kind of shit when you were in the Australian Army!

So, when it comes to pitting a boxer against someone who trained in the system the Marines teach, both fighters of approximately equal skill, I would place my money on the Marine because his training is not limited to using his hands and fighting under heavily controlled conditions. You said it yourself: it's the way the fighter trains that makes a difference.

And I disagree that sparring full contact all the time is the only way to go. Students of lower skill level would get knocked out before they realized they'd made a mistake and might not be able to reflect on what went wrong later. After I got knocked out a couple weeks ago, I'm still not sure what kind of strike my partner used and what I should have done differently. I think it was a kick only because it hurt, but it could well have been a hook punch for all I know.

Save full contact sparring for those who have lots of training already and are able to pick out their mistakes almost as they make them. Otherwise you're just n00b bashing! (Which, granted, can be fun)

[JoshAussie]

so basically i duno anything about shooting.. or army.. so im gona leave that bit alone.. but from what i do know marines are supposed to be trained in "MCMAP".. amnell said "both fighters of approximately equal skill" so id put my money on the marine to.. boxing is gona be useless when u get tackled to the ground and have your neck broken - but then again if it were a ring fight by ring rules.. a marines boxing skills arent going to be as profficient as a boxers.. as thats exactly what the boxer trains for and the other skills the marine has are going to be useless because his not allowed to use them

either way.. depends on the siuation

unless it was mike tyson in his prime.. hed fuck anyone up and eat your babies

[godwine]

Originally Posted by AnimeGod

I like Karate but stupid idiots like Wikipedia say it's from China, as if.

Well, I don't know who the stupid idiot is, but its infact from China. If you look at the history of Karate, all the way back to the Ryukyu Kobubdo, they do have a deep root in China.

As a matter, the most traditional Okinawa Karate (Goju and Shoto) have kata (Forms, Patterns) that came straight from China. In Goju, the Saifa, Shisochin, Sanseru are all from China, while Suparinpei took its origin from the following Chinese form: Dragon, Tiger and Buddah Fist. While in Shoto, the Kwanku kata and Jion kata with many others are also from China

[Nadea]

hmm i don't remember if i have been writing here so but i will say my opinion ^^

i don't think that some is better than the other, ,i like kungfu wushu, and i'm starting soon. i have tried it a couple of times and i simply love it. but i also love many others so i don't think that you can say that for example karate is much better than aikido. theyre both good...

[Jaydelart]

Originally Posted by AnimeGod

I like Karate but stupid idiots like Wikipedia say it's from China, as if.

Maybe they're not so stupid afterall. (^_^)

[zachart]

i still think my type of martial arts is the best.. well even though i don't have a name for it...

[Nadea]

well mine is a combination of kung fu tiger style and a little taijutsu, but i use strength most

[Amnell]

Originally Posted by Tenchu

Amnell, given I have been in the Army and been in fights with Infantry soldiers, it is kind of silly you dont listen to me. What you are talking about is all in theory. But the reality is most soldiers are just idiots with guns. I know only 2 soldiers from my Army time that my current self would question my ability to beat in a fight. This is because I have since learned Muay Thai, and these other guys, one did Muay Thai, the other fought in UFC. It is not because they were soldiers. Wake up to reality, Amnell.

I saw marines shooting at targets that I could have hit just by throwing rounds at it, and they were still missing. The main problem was they didn't seem to understand that an assault rifle is designed for single shots, and only fires autmomatic for close quarter emergencies.

Percentage stats saying "they have to pass" is rubbish, also.

An Army in wartime will lower its standards considerably for recruits. You think they will turn away those who cant hit the target? I dont. I know they didn't in Australia. Only 1 person legitimatly passed the F89 Minimi shoot we did on my training course, yet no one was kicked off, and the scores were 'edited' for 'errors'... The way I see the marines shoot does not make me think they would do any better than we did.

Can I ask, exactly, how big is a target they are shooting from 800m away? Is it a car, or a house? Seriously, the rifle can shoot that far, but not everyone can do it. Nor is it really reliable at that distance, or practical. A lot of people can not really see that far. If you think you can land a head shot without a scope at 800m then why dont you look out the window and see if you can actually see someones head at that distance. It starts to disappear at 400m, so I would like to see what kind of target they are hitting, if that is true at all. Where did you hear it?

Anyway, fact remains, there is no reason why a soldier should be considered a formidable hand to hand combat fighter.

But you've never been in the USMC, so you may as well know as much as I do. My grand-dad was a Marine drill instructor for about thirty years who taught hand-to-hand combat to recruits--and to his children. Now get this: at the age of sixteen, my mother, who is about half of my size, was getting into fights against large groups of girls who were older than her, men twice her size, multiple men bigger than her in bar fights, and was almost always winning those fights. The ironic thing about the bar fights is that she was usually trying to help her pussy husband, who was also a Marine. (Goes to show that not everyone's a bad ass--and yes, my mum married for the first time at sixteen)

Are you sure they were Marines and not Army?

If it's true that in wartime militaries lower their standards, than I'd sure hate to see what their standards are in peacetime. Like I said, the UN typically calls for US Marines to be sent to hotspots--not US Army, not Australian Army, not even British SAS or US Navy SEALs. Unless it's logistically stupid, it's always USMC. There's a damn good reason for that, whether you see it or not.

If someone landed a HEAD shot at 800 yards without a scope, they'd be god. Or very lucky. The targets, I'm sure, are large enough that they're visible and probably brightly coloured so that their easy to spot. The idea behind making the trainees shoot targets that far away is that they'll probably never have to shoot at that distance, but they will be much more reliable at more normal distances. I learned this from a class on military history, and it's been confirmed in various documentaries I've seen.

I would never make the mistake of assuming that someone is not a good fighter because he learned how to kill with a rifle. That's as stupid as assuming that the guy you're fighting on the street doesn't have a pistol concealed somewhere. So just because YOU can't see a reason why a soldier should be considered a formidable opponent, it doesn't mean that that isn't the case, anyway, and definitely doesn't mean that you should treat him as a weak oppononent.

I wonder how many poor fools have made that mistake about any soldier since the advent of the assault rifle and wound up dead for it...?

[JoshAussie]

lol.. Marine Fu

EDIT: hey Tenchu what was your day to day life like during your service? did you just play sports and do exercises to keep fit? to keep you in shape right? or is that stuff just the stuff you do in the 1 hour exercise every morning? also what about all the drills and weapons training?

wana stay on topic so mainly interested in the things you would day day to day to keep fit

what sort of hand to hand does the aus army use? (i have no experience with military)

and last thing for the whole point of those questions - if they have a structured hand to hand system they use wouldnt they do it alot of the time just during the times when there exercising and running differant drills? like wouldnt they do it so many hours a week?

anyway like i said no idea so im probably wrong