Platinum games (a.k.a Rape games) in Japan

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by DSX

This I agree with. If it keeps them from doing it IRL, then let them make the games. They could be potential lifesavers, and I'm sure that they have been before.

I have a real problem with this argument. Not only because it can't be backed up with any sort of study which links people that play games like this with sexually deviant behaviour (that I'm aware of anyway, in fact I think the closest study to this shows that people ARE influenced by the media. If I remember correctly, a study done a couple of years back showed that people who viewed violent media were more prone to violence or angry outbursts).

But the other problem I have with this argument is that it seems quite defeatist to me. Yes we all know that there are sexual deviants in society. But wouldn't a better approach be to fix society rather than give them outlets which might not even have an effect anyway? I believe the answer to this question is yes. For this reason I believe a ban on such media depicting rape so that the viewer may become sexually stimulated (not just games) is necessary.

[Salvanas]

Originally Posted by Salvanas

Because the only type of rape that is exaggerated, and over used, are female rape victims.

I mean, for example, how many times have you seen a male rape victim in the media? It's sexism in more ways than you'd imagine. And not just against women.

I'll turn your question on head actually, to drive the point home.

Why are women the only victims? Why isn't there any rape game where the woman is infact the rapist, and the man is the victim?

I can tell you now, that 90% of the answers to my question will be "Because men always want sex." But that's a typical sexist remark isn't it?

I'm always saddened to see a person bring up the sexism/woman card in rape situations. If I'm not mistaken, and I can remember properly, the statistics were that male rape victims were higher than female rape victims. I'll try to find the site, but I'm watching some TV at the moment.

Don't jump on the sexism bandwagon, please, Taln. You're so much more intelligent than that, and it's so much more deeper than sexism.

Sorry for quoting myself, but I tend to find that the last post on a page usually gets ignored, and I don't want my reply to get wash up throughout the posts that follow Ronins'.

However, I would like to reply to yours Ronin, but I'm slightly confused by the last post. Are you suggesting we ban rape games, so people are stimulated to raping women, so we can catch them?

I think I misread it, I just want to make sure.

[komitsuki]

Originally Posted by MMM

In Japan I have found that these fetish fantasy outlets (I wouldn't call them "games" in the same way) are seen as ways to satisfy a fantasy.

In the US many people see them as fueling the fantasy.

I don't know which is more correct, or if they are both wrong.

I think neither.

Here's the thing: I find it quite awkward that American or Canadian tourists or temporary residents in China, Korea, or Japan have very bipolar opinions on how people view sex. It is either very liberal or very conservative to them.

In the West, there is a huge tendency to bring sex-related issues to the public way way often whether it is negative (like Conservative religious people) or positive (like pride or culturally liberal people). So, there is an assumption that East Asians have a well-expressed and deep personal opinion on sex that could be shared by someone unfamiliar.

The answer is: People living in CKJ don't make sex-related issues as much as possible; very reserved opinion. Sex is really a personal stuff or closet stuff for few like-minded people over there.

When I used to live in South Korea, I have never seen anybody who would talk about sex to a familiar person unless it is a very close friend. Then again, when I had a sex-ed class in South Korea, it was more about academic purposes, no "sex is evil!" or "sex is good!" attitudes.

Hope that make sense. I can see huge differences between the attitudes.

[MMM]

I just want to make a distinction that fantasy and deviancy are not the same thing. I imagine everyone has fantasies and I imagine most people probably have fantasies that are a little deviant. However, just because a person has a fantasy doesn't mean they will act on it. Probably most people never have their fantasies "fulfilled" or even want to have it ACTUALLY fulfilled, as it is better as a fantasy than as a reality.

For example, the kissing on the beach scene in From Here to Eternity is considered a fan favorite because it is very romantic. Many women have said they would love to relive that scene. However rolling in the cold wet sand in your clothes and kissing while waves splash over you is actually not a very pleasant experience, according to the actors in that scene and those that have tried to repeat it.

That's part of the fantasy. So I doubt most of the people that enjoy rape fantasy software are really interested in actually raping people, but it is a fantasy that is realized in a fantasy world.

Like "moe" and cartoon girls saying "Hey big brother, let's play doctor!" Very popular stuff. Does that mean they want to have sex with their real life sister. I am pretty sure they don't. It's just a fantasy realized best in a fantasy world, not the real world.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by Salvanas

Sorry for quoting myself, but I tend to find that the last post on a page usually gets ignored, and I don't want my reply to get wash up throughout the posts that follow Ronins'.

However, I would like to reply to yours Ronin, but I'm slightly confused by the last post. Are you suggesting we ban rape games, so people are stimulated to raping women, so we can catch them?

I think I misread it, I just want to make sure.

No I'm saying that rape games be banned because rape is bad and that it shouldn't be rewarded or indulged in any way.

And I'm saying that the argument which claims that rape games are necessary as an outlet for potential rapists is complete bullsh*t.

[komitsuki]

Originally Posted by MMM

I just want to make a distinction that fantasy and deviancy are not the same thing.

Oh. But anyway, there is a huge difference between the West and CJK when it comes to perception of sex.

Sorry if I offended you by saying something too different.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by komitsuki

I think neither.

Here's the thing: I find it quite awkward that American or Canadian tourists or temporary residents in China, Korea, or Japan have very bipolar opinions on how people view sex. It is either very liberal or very conservative to them.

In the West, there is a huge tendency to bring sex-related issues to the public way way often whether it is negative (like Conservative religious people) or positive (like pride or culturally liberal people). So, there is an assumption that East Asians have a well-expressed and deep personal opinion on sex that could be shared by someone unfamiliar.

The answer is: People living in CKJ don't make sex-related issues as much as possible; very reserved opinion. Sex is really a personal stuff or closet stuff for few like-minded people over there.

When I used to live in South Korea, I have never seen anybody who would talk about sex to a familiar person unless it is a very close friend. Then again, when I had a sex-ed class in South Korea, it was more about academic purposes, no "sex is evil!" or "sex is good!" attitudes.

Hope that make sense. I can see huge differences between the attitudes.

It is true, it is hard for people to take off their cultural glasses. It seems like a lot of Westerners think Japan is liberal sexually because of its thriving porn industry, and I don't see how those two ideas could be connected. It's just people don't judge what happens behind closed doors.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by komitsuki

Oh. But anyway, there is a huge difference between the West and CJK when it comes to perception of sex.

Sorry if I offended you by saying something too different.

It would take a lot more to offend me, and I am not sure that was directed (only) at you.

[Ronin4hire]

Originally Posted by MMM

I just want to make a distinction that fantasy and deviancy are not the same thing. I imagine everyone has fantasies and I imagine most people probably have fantasies that are a little deviant. However, just because a person has a fantasy doesn't mean they will act on it. Probably most people never have their fantasies "fulfilled" or even want to have it ACTUALLY fulfilled, as it is better as a fantasy than as a reality.

For example, the kissing on the beach scene in From Here to Eternity is considered a fan favorite because it is very romantic. Many women have said they would love to relive that scene. However rolling in the cold wet sand in your clothes and kissing while waves splash over you is actually not a very pleasant experience, according to the actors in that scene and those that have tried to repeat it.

That's part of the fantasy. So I doubt most of the people that enjoy rape fantasy software are really interested in actually raping people, but it is a fantasy that is realized in a fantasy world.

Like "moe" and cartoon girls saying "Hey big brother, let's play doctor!" Very popular stuff. Does that mean they want to have sex with their real life sister. I am pretty sure they don't. It's just a fantasy realized best in a fantasy world, not the real world.

I think I need to see one of these rape games for myself maybe. I'm imagining these rape games to be simulated rape. Complete with crying, pleading for her life, possibly some violence, maybe a gun or knife held to the throat or head or even a loved one watching... you know pretty barbaric and disgusting stuff.

I can't imagine rape depicted acceptable... I mean I'm aware of the whole power fantasy. It's not rape though because you tend to think of the women as complicit in such fantasy scenarios.

[nobora]

what do you mean rape games