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05-27-2010, 02:17 AM
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One time I was supposed to pick up a client at 8:00 AM. At 8:03 I received a call from my boss asking me where I was. The client had called him at 8:01 to complain I hadn't arrived to pick him up. Now when I deal with Japanese men I show up 15 minutes early, and find that often times, they are already there. Quote:
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If it were to happen again and again "I'm sorry" is going to clearly mean less and less and will soon become unacceptable as the speaker clearly isn't feeling remorse, as the behavior hasn't changed. Quote:
Even "My mom forgot to wake me up, so I am not going to trust her to wake me up anymore," is still lame, as you are blaming your mom, but then are taking responsibility for her inaction. Quote:
If any of my friends "offered evidence of his commitment to change" after showing up late, I would just scratch my head. If a date did that to me, I doubt I would be asking for a next date. |
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05-27-2010, 02:25 AM
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You are absolutely right that the "but" negates the apology. I even said so in the previous post. But implies justification, which implies lack of guilt, and that negates any acceptance of guilt. I did say I was trying to reformulate the apology MissMisa wrote, and I clearly failed. I have said earlier it was a bad example. I have also previously admitted that such an apology as the one above is unrealistic. Please go back and consider my "schedule" apology which is far more realistic. |
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05-27-2010, 02:30 AM
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05-27-2010, 02:45 AM
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If a date did that to you on the first date, I would find it odd as well. You have no continuous relationship. A girlfriend is something else entirely. If you've never offered evidence of a commitment to change in a committed relationship, I would be very surprised. |
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05-27-2010, 02:52 AM
I was attempting to reformulate MissMisa's apology into one that had what I considered the requisite parts of an apology. There is absolutely no way I would have such a situation occur to me, so I can't say how exactly I would apologise for it.
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05-27-2010, 03:29 AM
I think you are mixing up the uses of "I'm sorry".
"I'm sorry about your father's death" is not an apology for any action the speaker did (assuming, of course, he didn't cause the father's death). That is very different from "I apologize for your father's death" which is an admission of guilt. So saying "I'm sorry" is showing remorse, but is not necessarily an admission of guilt. However, an admission of guilt without any remorse is not an apology. "I was late. So what?" is an admission of guilt without showing remorse. I think you can show admission of guilt and show remorse in a mistake you made by apologizing and saying "I'm sorry." As for the military comparison, I don't think I am hung up on it, I am just saying it appears they do things differently than the civilian world, which might help explain your perspective that the non-military members here do not share. As an adult, I would not take your action plan to help ensure I am not tardy again as condescending. Supervisor or not, I would not take it as showing me care or respect. I would call it demeaning. They may do this in the military, and maybe it is because they can, but I don't think this would work in the working world unless it was something I thought I needed your help with. |
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05-27-2010, 03:49 AM
This is a valid disagreement on the nature "sorry."
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Only if you prove yourself incapable of doing so would I do it for you. And that is way beyond the scope of an initial apology. Our disagreement stems from whether it is reasonable or not to expect and/or ask for that plan of action to be briefly outlined. I think it is. You think it is not. |
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05-27-2010, 07:28 AM
So in the end, the reason we disagree is because what you think the word 'sorry' means is different to what I think it means.
With my example, 'I didn't wake up because my alarm batteries ran out and my mum didn't wake me up' would you accept it would have just been better to say, 'I'm sorry I'm late.'? Or what would you actually say instead? I'd never do this either, but if someone ended up doing it, they'd have to figure out how to say sorry somehow. |
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05-27-2010, 08:14 AM
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In my area, all the private schools were single sex schools, so our topic doesn't come into it. I think there were good and bad things about the mixing for PE. For one, that's where I changed my mind about girls' abilities. Before playing basketball with girls, I always thought that girls were "weaker" at sports than boys. But I found that some girls were bad-ass and were running circles around us boys lol. But on the negative side, the boys were less serious and didn't play properly when there were girls. They always wanted to flirt or something! To be honest, I think the best thing to do, is mix PE class but have levels. So, the best play together, the worst together. Just like they did in all the other subjects! I spent 1 week in the worst math group there was, and I wanted to kill myself! When they moved me up to a better group with everyone having the same level, I felt like I was learning! |
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