Employment with Ikkyu but no degree?

[Cragget]

Hi everybody,

I'm slightly reticent to open a brand new thread asking questions about obtaining a working visa without a degree; however, I'm planning to move to Japan in September of this year to begin studying at a Japanese language institute for 18-months, at the completion of which I'll sit the Level 1 proficiency test. I've studied Japanese previously and have visited many times. I'm conversationally fluent although I can't watch the news too easily and keep up. I can read about 700-800 kanji and can write about 300.

I also fall into the category of being one of those gaijin that doesn't have a university degree but will eventually end up seeking employment or further education after my course is finished.

Does anybody have any advice on what kind of employment opportunities I might be afforded with ikkyu but without a degree? Alternatively, what suggestions do people have for courses to study in Japan should I end up needing to further my education at university?

Any thoughts, comments or suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

[Anjin]

How old are you?

[Nyororin]

First, there are a few things to be aware of.

Assuming that you DO sit for and pass the test - the 一級 alone says little about your language skill other than that you could pass the test. It is usually a bonus to have, but it doesn`t signal that you have true skill at the language. There are countless people out there who study for the test, pass the test, but who can`t speak Japanese at even an elementary level. It has gotten a little bit better in recent years as they`ve changed the format for some parts of the test, but there is only so far you can go with a non-interactive test.

I recognize that you have some level of language skill, and that as you`ll be studying in Japan you will likely be able to hold your own after the course...
However, with just the 一級, you`ll be in the same market as everyone else who studied for the test and managed to pass.
You are going to need something distinguishing you other than the JLPT. Basically, some other skills. It will be very difficult, if not near impossible, to find any type of job with just the JLPT and no degree / experience / special skills.

My advice - after getting the JLPT1, apply for normal university in Japan - and attend. It will improve your language skills, interaction, and get you a visa to stay in Japan for the length of the education... And the bonus of a degree at the end. Once you have the JLPT1 in hand, you should be able to apply to any university (not just those with international courses).

[Cragget]

Anjin, I'm 26 in August. : )

Nyororin, thank you very much for your reply and your advice about seeking further education. It does answer some questions I had about exactly how many gaijin there were in Japan who could sit for, and pass the JLPT1 test. However, I must admit that I find it very difficult to believe that a person could pass the JLPT1 test without at the very least being able to fluently speak Japanese at a conversational level.

Thank you, once again, for your reply.

[MMM]

Originally Posted by Cragget

Anjin, I'm 26 in August. : )

Nyororin, thank you very much for your reply and your advice about seeking further education. It does answer some questions I had about exactly how many gaijin there were in Japan who could sit for, and pass the JLPT1 test. However, I must admit that I find it very difficult to believe that a person could pass the JLPT1 test without at the very least being able to fluently speak Japanese at a conversational level.

Thank you, once again, for your reply.

I have been surprised by people who can translate well and pass the JLPT1 and can't carry a conversation in Japanese.

[Cragget]

That's unbelievable! It's not a concept I can grasp at all, to be honest, but I'll take your word for it.

I had the bold idea of perhaps studying communications at university after my 18-month course so that I can run my own freelance interpreting business.

Is this an aspiration you guys have seen talked about a lot, here? I figured with ikkyu and a degree in communications, I'd have something to market myself with. Also, I have double-jointed thumbs and can accurately guess what key your fridge is humming in within five seconds. Surely they're well sought after assets!

[Nyororin]

It does answer some questions I had about exactly how many gaijin there were in Japan who could sit for, and pass the JLPT1 test.

Asian foreigners in Japan who have passed the JLPT1? Tons.
From other places? Not quite as many.

The JLPT1 is usually the "goal" for longer term language courses, and one of the requirements for enrolling into a Japanese university. This means that there are tons of courses tailored to get people to pass the test, and that alone. Drilling on sample questions may give you the ability to make it through the exam, but it doesn`t mean you`ll be able to use that knowledge outside of the controlled test environment.

"Studying for the test" does not mean "learning the material". You can easily cram for a multiple-choice test and pass it without understanding or being able to use the information.

For someone who has learned Japanese in an immersion environment, studying it in some find of reasonable progression, and who has good conversational skills - the JLPT1 can be a good measure. But the majority of those taking it are students from Asian countries because they have to pass it to enroll in a Japanese university program. They start at zero and cram for the test, without the goal ever really being proficiency.

I have been surprised by people who can translate well and pass the JLPT1 and can't carry a conversation in Japanese.

Knowing a ton of kanji and grammatical patterns will take you at least half the way to passing. They never test on speaking or composition, and all the questions are multiple choice. It`s really not THAT difficult a test, all in all.

In translation there is no need for a quick response, so they can sit and think then reference a dictionary. In speaking there is no way to pull that off.

[ryuurui]

Originally Posted by MMM

I have been surprised by people who can translate well and pass the JLPT1 and can't carry a conversation in Japanese.

its the same as Japanese people who can type in fluent English but cant construct a decent sentence. It is the education system model failure. They are taught to learn patterns by heart and not to think creatively. JLPT was created by the Japanese. There's where the problem lays.

[Cragget]

Thank you so much, everybody, for your detailed responses. They've given me a much clearer picture of the JLPT tests and what they can and can't do for me, accreditation-wise.

I'm hoping that, being an Australian, having ikkyu will be somewhat of an asset along with a university degree. Can anybody provide me with some links on this forum to discussions about living as a student in Japan and finding suitable work? I'll have a browse myself, certainly.

Also, what of the double-jointed thumb and perfect fridge pitch qualities?? Does anybody else find them to be as good a marketing idea as I do?

Thank you again, everyone.

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by ryuurui

JLPT was created by the Japanese. There's where the problem lays.

No, the problem lies in that it is a written test trying to measure something that is largely spoken.

Another good example - someone deaf can easily pass a written test about music.

It`s the concept itself that is flawed. Not because it was "created by the Japanese". I was able to pass countless written French tests back in high school by simply studying for the test, with no real language ability (and certainly none retained). I`m sure those weren`t also created by the Japanese...