Learn Japanese if you want to live in Japan

[GoNative]

Somewhat amazingly if anything my Japanese got worse the longer I lived in Japan. I had done close to a year of study before going and a year after arriving went and did a 3 month intensive course in Sapporo. All in all I was getting pretty good at general conversation. Living in the Niseko area though I rarely got to use much Japanese. All my Japanese friends spoke good to excellent english and I had a lot of foreign friends where english was the main language used. All of the tourists I dealt with spoke english and in the workplace english was the main language. So as the years went by I only rarely spoke Japanese and lost a lot of what I had learned.

In the area I lived though not having much Japanese didn't mean you couldn't live a great life. There was a very close and vibrant community of people who did a lot of things together throughout the year. We all lived pretty active and exciting lives working hard and playing hard. Of course if I hadn't lived in the Niseko area my life would have been very different and I would have used and improved my Japanese greatly. I do regret not leaning more but there just wasn't the need to do so to have an enjoyable life.

[WingsToDiscovery]

Originally Posted by Umihito

With the kind of culture that Japan has, I'm guessing these are the disappointed people who quit early...

And to keep on topic... I bet they don't speak Japanese either! :L

Yeah, I've known a couple of people who came here thinking the entire country was going to be some kind of anime/manga fantasy land. They ended up not making it very long and going home.

And I actually got in the face of a guy at Atom (a popular night club in Tokyo) for being totally out of line and yelling at one of the staff and getting frustrated because the staff member couldn't speak English.

[tokusatsufan]

Originally Posted by GoNative

Somewhat amazingly if anything my Japanese got worse the longer I lived in Japan. I had done close to a year of study before going and a year after arriving went and did a 3 month intensive course in Sapporo. All in all I was getting pretty good at general conversation. Living in the Niseko area though I rarely got to use much Japanese. All my Japanese friends spoke good to excellent english and I had a lot of foreign friends where english was the main language used. All of the tourists I dealt with spoke english and in the workplace english was the main language. So as the years went by I only rarely spoke Japanese and lost a lot of what I had learned.

In the area I lived though not having much Japanese didn't mean you couldn't live a great life. There was a very close and vibrant community of people who did a lot of things together throughout the year. We all lived pretty active and exciting lives working hard and playing hard. Of course if I hadn't lived in the Niseko area my life would have been very different and I would have used and improved my Japanese greatly. I do regret not leaning more but there just wasn't the need to do so to have an enjoyable life.

Interesting. Cool story bro! I don't know if you should be encouraging people
not to learn Japanese though!

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by tokusatsufan

Interesting. Cool story bro! I don't know if you should be encouraging people
not to learn Japanese though!

I don`t think he is encouraging anyone to stop learning Japanese. I read it as his personal experience. Living where he lived and doing what he did, he experienced a deterioration of his Japanese rather than an improvement.

I don`t think it is an isolated case, really. There are countless foreigners in Japan who cannot speak Japanese, even after 10+ years in the country. They just surround themselves with English speakers, and do not go out of their way to learn. People tend to take the easiest route to communication - if everyone around you can speak English... Why bother with Japanese?

[tokusatsufan]

Yeah,that doesn't help our image over there.

[BobbyCooper]

Originally Posted by WingsToDiscovery

Yeah, I really hate to sound condescending, but a large majority of people I've met fit into three categories.
- The asshole who thinks he can bang every girl and abuse the system
- The social outcast who thinks they can make it in Japan because they're gaijin
- The fresh worker who doesn't know what they want to do yet so they think teaching in a foreign country will be a pushover job

I've met some really lovely people and also some people I know who will be lifelong friends, but to say that the typical person who comes to Japan (to live) is worth my time is a bit of a stretch.

Why would anyone who comes to Japan spend his time over there with a foreigner? Thats the last thing I would do!

So, I can understand them pretty well if they came of to you that way. Why would they be willing to sympathize with a regular foreigner if there all these lovely Japanese around? Something so totally different??

Not saying that this isn't the truth.. but you might think that of myself too, even though it's not the case. I would ignore you most likely and try to get rid of you, spend my time with lovely Japanese girls and boys between breaks instead of talking to your regular bad habits you recognised while being in Japan

[GoNative]

Originally Posted by tokusatsufan

Yeah,that doesn't help our image over there.

It's not something that I consider that bad myself. Having grown up in Australia, which is one of the most multicultural countries anywhere (1 in 4 people living in Australia were born overseas), it's not unusual at all to have communities where many of the older people don't speak english much at all. Their children though do speak english and then the next generation speaks english with an Australian accent barely distinguashable from Aussies who've been there for many generations.

I actually believe Niseko is a great example of how people from many different countries can come to live in Japan in a very harmonious way, even if they can't speak the language fluently. Niseko is definitely going to produce a large number of bilingual children (it already has actually) as there's been quite a baby boom there in recent years. I'll be interested to see what these kids go on to do.

[GoNative]

Originally Posted by BobbyCooper

Why would anyone who comes to Japan spend his time over there with a foreigner? Thats the last thing I would do!

The thing I find interesting with this sort of attitude is it seems to me rather particular to people who travel to Japan. I mean if you were to travel to say Mexico would you only want to meet Mexicans? If you travelled to France would you only want to associate with French people and no one else?

Personally I've travelled to something like 20 different countries and I really don't care about the nationality of the people I meet along the way. If they are interesting people, they are interesting people be they native to that country or not. I had the same attitude during my 7 years in Japan and ended up making great friends with people from many countries including Japanese people.

[BobbyCooper]

Originally Posted by GoNative

The thing I find interesting with this sort of attitude is it seems to me rather particular to people who travel to Japan. I mean if you were to travel to say Mexico would you only want to meet Mexicans? If you travelled to France would you only want to associate with French people and no one else?

Personally I've travelled to something like 20 different countries and I really don't care about the nationality of the people I meet along the way. If they are interesting people, they are interesting people be they native to that country or not. I had the same attitude during my 7 years in Japan and ended up making great friends with people from many countries including Japanese people.

Oh I agree! This doesn't count for the countries you mentioned, at least not for me. I am what you would call an Asian fanatic or Japanophile. I do not appreciate the Western Society that much.. I Love the Asian culture and the way people behave and act down there.

I am glad to escape from the Western society even if it's just for 1 year.. Not enough time for me to spend time with people who I've been with 23 years now already..

I go there to experience Japan and to get a different view of life. And If a regular foreigner wants to hang out with me I am glady to say no thanks!

[RickOShay]

Originally Posted by BobbyCooper

Oh I agree! This doesn't count for the countries you mentioned, at least not for me. I am what you would call an Asian fanatic or Japanophile. I do not appreciate the Western Society that much.. I Love the Asian culture and the way people behave and act down there.

I am glad to escape from the Western society even if it's just for 1 year.. Not enough time for me to spend time with people who I've been with 23 years now already..

I go there to experience Japan and to get a different view of life. And If a regular foreigner wants to hang out with me I am glady to say no thanks!

Well you better bring a day planner then, because I find most Japanese people prefer you give them a least a few days notice before you hang out. And just because a Japanese person says hey we should hang out or go drinking sometime, it does not necessarily actually mean they want to hang out or go drinking sometime. Not sure why am bothering to tell you this though since you just seem to ignore all the voices of reason, wisdom and experience on this forum.