Is a house in Japan less or more than most average homes in the U.S.A?

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by DanteSan

Guess I left out I realize the prices are different depending on geography, that seems like common sense. I understand the idea of living cost and housing, it's most likely not much different than here. The question was are there places like that in Tokyo, answer is not likely, like living in L.A or New York. Understood. Thanks for the help? Stupid question I guess, like I just said, not much different than here. Apologies.

I wasn`t trying to be nasty toward you specifically. It just gets to be a bit exasperating when people only look at Tokyo then gawk when it`s more than small-town-USA. This happens all the time, and I can`t even count how many times I`ve said "Don`t live in Tokyo" to people.

I figured you were talking about the whole of Japan because you compared the prices of Tokyo to the prices of Salt Lake City. If you`d been comparing NY or LA to Tokyo, or Salt Lake City to Kagoshima or Hamamatsu, I think my response would have been different. Comparing two entirely different classes of cities is like comparing apples and oranges.

[GoNative]

Originally Posted by siokan

The country and the municipality preserve value as a cultural asset.
The house that old rich people built is strong. Other plants and buildings design simple in consideration of a fire.
Maintenance can be done if there are a resolution and money in which three new houses are bought.

not easy to live+Money hangs+weak to the disaster=hell on earth

It is specified for the cultural asset, and the relative who was not able to move complains. "i want house to burn"(seriously)

I understand there are many reasons why so much architectural heritage has been lost but I still think it's a great shame. I mean if you travel through Europe so much architectural heritage has been preserved. Whole towns have building overlays and restrictions so that the character of the town is retained. Nearly every town you go through is an historical wonder. There's a few towns like that in Japan but really only a few. Most in my eyes were pretty damned ugly. It's a real pity in my opinion. For a country that has such an old and established culture I was kind of blown away by the lack of aesthetic beauty in most towns. And for gods sake why oh why can they not put the powerlines underground????? The powerlines are about the ugliest thing in all Japanese towns and cities. Some places do have them underground and what an incredible difference it makes!

[Sangetsu]

I recently moved to a new apartment in the heart of Tokyo in Chiyoda-ku. By Japanese standards it is large, being 54 square meters. At the moment, Tokyo housing and rentals are depressed, selling or renting for the same price they did in the early 1980's. Still, my rent is about $2000 USD per month.

Last year I visited a new housing development in Chiba, about an hour from Tokyo. This development was being built in the western style; single family detached homes with garages as well as front and back yards. Even the designs of the homes were western, with English-style brick homes, American Cape Cod designs, and even California Sanish-style plans, complete with red tile roofs. The prices of these homes were very reasonable, the largest one (200 square meters) was less expensive than my current apartment.

But buying a home in Japan is not easy for foreigners. There are no restrictions against foreigners owning property in Japan, but getting a home loan is nearly impossible if you don't have permanent residency. I would lve to buy a home, perhaps in 2 or 3 years.

[Sangetsu]

Originally Posted by GoNative

I understand there are many reasons why so much architectural heritage has been lost but I still think it's a great shame. I mean if you travel through Europe so much architectural heritage has been preserved. Whole towns have building overlays and restrictions so that the character of the town is retained. Nearly every town you go through is an historical wonder. There's a few towns like that in Japan but really only a few. Most in my eyes were pretty damned ugly. It's a real pity in my opinion. For a country that has such an old and established culture I was kind of blown away by the lack of aesthetic beauty in most towns. And for gods sake why oh why can they not put the powerlines underground????? The powerlines are about the ugliest thing in all Japanese towns and cities. Some places do have them underground and what an incredible difference it makes!

There aren't much in the way of building codes or standards in Japan. You can build anything you want, regardless of how ugly or poorly made, so long as the building has three or less floors. There are no regulations requiring that your new home be built to match the architecture of the surroundings, such as there are in America or Europe. Walk through a neighborhood in Tokyo and you'll see run-down shacks buried behind apartment buildings and newer homes. You can paint your home any color you want, from the vilest shade of mustard-yellow to the brightest blood red.

New Japanese houses are simply ugly. They are block-like, built with as much sense to style as machinegun pillboxes on the Normandy beaches. The windows are high and small, affording no views, the doors are metal, with a camera and intercom. In a country as safe as Japan is, people seem to prefer homes and apartments which are as secure as prisons, and even styled after such. My own apartment is concrete and steel, and the architecture seems inspired by a fire department building.

I much prefer the traditional Japanese houses, poorly insulated and fire-prone as they are. I see them come up for sale from time to time, at bargain prices.

[evanny]

ahhh. i've read about the bullshit that is building laws in communities in USA.there was a community that demanded you to sign 500 page long document that explains what and how you can build. it even demanded that you have a special grass for your lawn which has to be of certain hight and always has to be green - no brown spots allowed.
i know that in my country there aren't any of these rules. if you see several look-a-like houses that means some rich guy has bought huge land and built them using a single plan so to save money on design costs.

[GoNative]

Originally Posted by Sangetsu

There aren't much in the way of building codes or standards in Japan. You can build anything you want, regardless of how ugly or poorly made, so long as the building has three or less floors. There are no regulations requiring that your new home be built to match the architecture of the surroundings, such as there are in America or Europe. Walk through a neighborhood in Tokyo and you'll see run-down shacks buried behind apartment buildings and newer homes. You can paint your home any color you want, from the vilest shade of mustard-yellow to the brightest blood red.

New Japanese houses are simply ugly. They are block-like, built with as much sense to style as machinegun pillboxes on the Normandy beaches. The windows are high and small, affording no views, the doors are metal, with a camera and intercom. In a country as safe as Japan is, people seem to prefer homes and apartments which are as secure as prisons, and even styled after such. My own apartment is concrete and steel, and the architecture seems inspired by a fire department building.

I much prefer the traditional Japanese houses, poorly insulated and fire-prone as they are. I see them come up for sale from time to time, at bargain prices.

There are some towns though where they have put in some effort. In the area I used to live the town of Niseko had a building code for all buildings along the main street and they've put in nice wide paved sidewalks and the powerlines are underground. It has a pleasant aesthetic and is such a big contrast to most of the other towns in the area. They just had a mayor with a bit of vision who was willing to do something a little different. Of course such people are rare in Japan...

[Nyororin]

Originally Posted by Sangetsu

There aren't much in the way of building codes or standards in Japan. You can build anything you want, regardless of how ugly or poorly made, so long as the building has three or less floors.

Know how I can tell you`ve never tried to build a house in Japan?

Structurally, Japan has some of the strictest standards in the world. (A couple years ago it was the strictest structural building code in the world, but I don`t have the newest info. Probably still is though, as it was worlds above the next step down.) They tend to upgrade the standards almost every year, making it harder and harder to build.
Houses take forever and cost a ridiculous amount in part because at every step of the way, you have to have an inspector come in and check whether it is up to code.

There are also extremely detailed laws on how large the building can be, how close it can be to the edge of the lot, the angle of the roof, how much light can be blocked from the neighboring lots, etc, that change on each individual lot.

The appearance of a building does not reflect how sturdy it is structurally, and has nothing to do with building code. Being ugly or having a crappy outer facing is not something that building codes cover.

There is a reason every house in Japan doesn`t fall over when there is a tremor. To put it into perspective, someone I know (friend of family) in the US had to write off their (3 year old, $400,000) house after a 3.something earthquake last year. The whole house slipped off the foundation and the chimney completely fell over, pulling part of the roof with it... Japan is the last place I would accuse of having lax building codes.

There are no regulations requiring that your new home be built to match the architecture of the surroundings, such as there are in America or Europe.

It all depends on the location. There are areas with regulations on the appearance and some areas have laws on the books forcing you to match everything down to the color to that of the neighborhood. It`s all about location - I highly doubt that * everywhere* in the US or Europe has that sort of regulation.

Walk through a neighborhood in Tokyo and you'll see run-down shacks buried behind apartment buildings and newer homes.

So... People who live in old houses should tear them down to match the newer homes and apartment buildings? Or the new buildings should have been built to match the much older buildings? I don`t get what you are trying to say here after what you said above. People don`t build new "run-down shacks". Those are mostly immediately post-war. Money doesn`t grow on trees, so for a lot of people it is not feasible to tear them down and build anew when a lot of new buildings are built in the area.

New Japanese houses are simply ugly. They are block-like, built with as much sense to style as machinegun pillboxes on the Normandy beaches.

I agree that they aren`t the prettiest to look at, but function trumps form when you only have a small space to work with.

The windows are high and small, affording no views, the doors are metal, with a camera and intercom. In a country as safe as Japan is, people seem to prefer homes and apartments which are as secure as prisons, and even styled after such.

Views? You live somewhere that has a view? If most of these houses had large windows, you`d be staring at your neighbors wall. Or be visible to anyone walking by. Or even worse, staring *in* your neighbors window...
Privacy is the key, not security. People don`t want other people looking in and seeing the only space that is entirely private. In tight neighborhoods, people DO try to look. I can`t imagine how much it would suck to have the old woman next door gossiping about how she saw me throwing away perfectly good food through the kitchen window... Or how she couldn`t believe we were still in our pajamas after 8am! (Real complaints I have heard...)
In tightly packed spaces, privacy is at a premium. I cannot fault anyone for wanting to protect it... Especially as the reason we opted not to build a house and to buy a マンション was privacy.

I much prefer the traditional Japanese houses, poorly insulated and fire-prone as they are. I see them come up for sale from time to time, at bargain prices.

Aesthetically, so do I. But I have lived in one... so definitely would not choose to do so again. They`re great to look at, but you can`t forget that people have to deal with living in them.

[Nyororin]

Would have put these together, but it was too long. Please excuse the double post.

Originally Posted by GoNative

I understand there are many reasons why so much architectural heritage has been lost but I still think it's a great shame. I mean if you travel through Europe so much architectural heritage has been preserved. Whole towns have building overlays and restrictions so that the character of the town is retained. Nearly every town you go through is an historical wonder. There's a few towns like that in Japan but really only a few. Most in my eyes were pretty damned ugly. It's a real pity in my opinion. For a country that has such an old and established culture I was kind of blown away by the lack of aesthetic beauty in most towns.

It`s my understanding that this is largely because of the massive level of bombing Japan experienced during the war. Anything that could burn, burnt. This included all the old historical buildings. There are patches here and there that made it through without being completely destroyed, but almost anywhere that could be called a town was hit.
They rebuilt with incredible speed - but housing the huge number of displaced people was the number one concern... So ugly boxes it was. They`re the fastest to build. The population boom of the 50s and 60s that followed kept the quick-housing trend going.

It`s sad to see pictures of locations prior to the bombing... And then just a couple years later with everything replaced by "emergency" housing.

These days, people are taught to be almost overly terrified of fire, so you see houses built using as little flammable material as possible. But I suppose when you hear stories of one bomb starting the fire that wiped out the entire neighborhood... Or one stove that fell over during a minor quake that destroyed 50 houses... people get scared.

And for gods sake why oh why can they not put the powerlines underground????? The powerlines are about the ugliest thing in all Japanese towns and cities. Some places do have them underground and what an incredible difference it makes!

Remember the places with them underground, and check their electrical outages after an earthquake. Electricity is lifeline #1. You can string the lines along the ground should the poles fall to deliver power. If the underground containment pipe breaks, there is nothing you can do for quite some time.
People ALWAYS protest putting the wires underground for these reasons. Even in areas that have most underground, they will usually have some percentage of them above ground that power hospitals and other vital facilities.

You can occasionally see footage of workers rolling wire by hand in areas where there was a serious earthquake to get power to hospitals and shelters... But when the wires are underground, you need to get equipment in there to dig them up - not to mention that the entire bundle has to be shut off. (Shutting off power to vital locations in the process.)

The wires are ugly as crap and look awful, but as long as Japan has earthquakes, I will oppose putting them underground.

[Lonthego]

Originally Posted by Nyororin

Would have put these together, but it was too long. Please excuse the double post.



It`s my understanding that this is largely because of the massive level of bombing Japan experienced during the war. Anything that could burn, burnt. This included all the old historical buildings. There are patches here and there that made it through without being completely destroyed, but almost anywhere that could be called a town was hit.
They rebuilt with incredible speed - but housing the huge number of displaced people was the number one concern... So ugly boxes it was. They`re the fastest to build. The population boom of the 50s and 60s that followed kept the quick-housing trend going.

Bingo!!! I was wondering when someone was going to say it.
There was massive firebombing of Japan. The US chose firebombing because the majority of houses were made of wood and paper and many were so close together they were actually touching.
Not a whole lot left standing after that..

[GoNative]

Originally Posted by Nyororin

It`s my understanding that this is largely because of the massive level of bombing Japan experienced during the war. Anything that could burn, burnt. This included all the old historical buildings. There are patches here and there that made it through without being completely destroyed, but almost anywhere that could be called a town was hit.
They rebuilt with incredible speed - but housing the huge number of displaced people was the number one concern... So ugly boxes it was. They`re the fastest to build. The population boom of the 50s and 60s that followed kept the quick-housing trend going.

It`s sad to see pictures of locations prior to the bombing... And then just a couple years later with everything replaced by "emergency" housing.

These days, people are taught to be almost overly terrified of fire, so you see houses built using as little flammable material as possible. But I suppose when you hear stories of one bomb starting the fire that wiped out the entire neighborhood... Or one stove that fell over during a minor quake that destroyed 50 houses... people get scared.
as Japan has earthquakes, I will oppose putting them underground.

Nyororin many cities and towns in Europe were just as, if not more bombed out than Japanese cities and towns. They managed to rebuild and keep the character and spirit of what was lost to bombing. Japan didn't and it's an absolute shame.
And to be honest I haven't been to that many bigger cities in Japan which would have been the main targets. Most places I've been I doubt were targets at all and still they are on the whole what I consider very ugly. For a people whose architectural heritage is one where aesthetics was so important it's a real pity that in modern times they just don't seem to care. They accept living in really ugly towns.
What really amazed me in the area I lived was that we had one of the most beautiful mountains in Japan, Mt Youtei, known as Fuji of the North. And yet so many houses, even those on sizeable blocks of land seemed to have little to no design features to take advantage of the views of this maginficent peak. Even farm houses with land all around them where there would be no restrictions on how to position the house would often barely even have a small window or two facing the mountain. It shocked me because on the whole I found the Japanese to be really into and have a connection with the natural world around them. They really seemed to love the outdoors. And yet here they have one of the more beautiful natural wonders of Japan on their doorstep and they build houses that barely even take advantage of the view at all. I just couldn't understand it. All of the newer development by foreigners in the region of course designed homes and apartments so that the views were maximised. Such consideration just didn't seem to come into it for most of the locals.