Inter-racial attraction

[mercedesjin]

Originally Posted by bELyVIS

I wasn't going to answer any more of your questions, because you won't change my opinion and I won't change yours (if you are happy with it I wouldn't want to).
As I see it, you are a black female, with a sexual idenity crisis who is very angry. Get over it. As far as being a second class anything, you and you alone are responsible for allowing yourself to feel that way.

OH PLEASE. Yes, I'm angry. You basically just told me my culture doesn't matter - isn't really "American." Yes, I'm angry. You're sexist and has just implied, time and again, that because I'm a woman I need to submit to a man in order for our relationship to work. Yes, I'm angry. You just said I have a sexual identity crisis just because you don't understand sexuality.

"Get over it"? No, I won't - because that's the only thing racist, sexist assholes can say when they don't see that the correct response would be to apologize. No, I won't - because the idea of "getting over it" is what was expected of many oppressed races and genders when abused. So no. I won't.

I'm responsible for how I feel. That's true. The same is true for the people who belonged to generations of races that were wiped out, cultures that were assimilated and destroyed.

EDIT: I shouldn't have implied that you're an asshole, and I'm sorry about that. I just got pretty upset, because I thought you were a little out of place to imply the things that you did. I am sorry, though.

[MMM]

The next person who cannot post with out name calling or insulting will go on vacation.

[mercedesjin]

Originally Posted by xYinniex

EPIC FAIL.
Blaming women of the main problems in the world, yet she's exempt from it.
I thought feminism was female empowerment, not putting down other women in the process.

man-hating literature is great to study but as a female, I don't actually feel it's necessary to follow. It's great to be aware of the social difference, but to make it into something out of proportion is unnecessary.

Why is this an "epic fail"? What do you mean, "yet she's exempt from it"? Why do you think she's putting other women down? I see it as a woman looking at a certain way of life and refusing to follow that way.

I've seen and experienced the idea that women belong in the kitchen, the idea that women belong to men. This idea flourishes today. Studying it isn't enough. Studying it and examining one's own life, analyzing one's own experiences, is necessary. What's the point of realizing that something is wrong and then letting it continue? Realizing that one suffers from sexism, and deciding to fight against sexism, isn't blowing something out of proportion.

Also, why do you think this is man-hating literature? I read and reread the passage to see if I'd missed something, but not once did I see an insult towards men. All I saw was the acknowledgment that men have oppressed women.

[MMM]

This sums it up for me:

Thus for Frye, Whiteness, heterosexuality, and sexism are bound together in ways that institute and enforce patriarchy.

[peterv20]

what's the difference?who cares what color or culture your attraction is.as long as they have a sweet smile and a pure heart.or am i just dreaming?

[Nyororin]

In an attempt to lighten the mood, here is an honest question to Mercedesjin...
How do you view (most likely heterosexual) women who do indeed feel that men should be the workers / the bread winners / defenders of the women - while the women devote more time and attention to the home and to children? How about women who feel that the man is and should be in control in a relationship and who are completely willing to take the subservient role?

I am honestly curious about your opinion when this is a choice made by the woman.

[mercedesjin]

Originally Posted by Nyororin

In an attempt to lighten the mood, here is an honest question to Mercedesjin...
How do you view (most likely heterosexual) women who do indeed feel that men should be the workers / the bread winners / defenders of the women - while the women devote more time and attention to the home and to children? How about women who feel that the man is and should be in control in a relationship and who are completely willing to take the subservient role?

I am honestly curious about your opinion when this is a choice made by the woman.

My first reaction is repulsion. I immediately feel like these women are both victims to an oppressive system and people who willingly promote an oppressive system. To me, willing choices reflect how a person has been conditioned to think and act by society. (For example, a sexist man who has been raised to think that women are inferior can make the choice to rape a woman, in the same way that a woman who has been raised to think that women are inferior can make the choice to stay at home.)

There are women who are conscious of the idea that they are somehow inferior, and think that women belong in the house. They promote this idea to men and women they encounter - and, even worst, to their children if they ever have any. Because they also spread the idea that women are inferior, I see them not only as victims but as oppressors.

Those are my initial thoughts... but then I'm also a little curious. I'd want to know WHY these women think that their place is in the household, and why they think they're inferior to men. I'd want to know why these women think that they need a man to go out and make money, to protect them, etc.

[bELyVIS]

Originally Posted by mercedesjin

OH PLEASE. Yes, I'm angry. You basically just told me my culture doesn't matter - isn't really "American." Yes, I'm angry. You're sexist and has just implied, time and again, that because I'm a woman I need to submit to a man in order for our relationship to work. Yes, I'm angry. You just said I have a sexual identity crisis just because you don't understand sexuality.

"Get over it"? No, I won't - because that's the only thing racist, sexist assholes can say when they don't see that the correct response would be to apologize. No, I won't - because the idea of "getting over it" is what was expected of many oppressed races and genders when abused. So no. I won't.

I'm responsible for how I feel. That's true. The same is true for the people who belonged to generations of races that were wiped out, cultures that were assimilated and destroyed.

EDIT: I shouldn't have implied that you're an asshole, and I'm sorry about that. I just got pretty upset, because I thought you were a little out of place to imply the things that you did. I am sorry, though.

How am I racist? You were the one upset that you felt other races thought black people less attractive. I have seen many attractive black women. Wouldn't you say it is racist to assume another race finds your race unattractive? You are the one with the problem about your race. No one here said anything bad that I remember and certainly not I.
How am I sexist? I never said women were inferior. My whole thing about relationships goes back to how traditional relationships were and are based, the man is the head of the family. The reason that this is a problem nowadays is that men are still being taught this role while women are being taught to be independent. This makes the man feel like he has failed in his role. Equal roles in this relationship will cause a power struggle. Now I am not saying women can't be equal in this relationship, most women know how to persuade a man to give into her thinking. This has been happening since the beginning of time and still does. My wife is very skilled at this and she gets her way without making my role feel threatened.
Did you not claim you were gay and then bisexual? Why would submitting to a man be a part of these relationships? I never said that you have to submit to anyone so quit putting words into my mouth. Even in gay relationships one takes a dominant role and the other submissive. Too equals will again cause a power struggle. You need to find out which you prefer and go from there. I know what I am, but you can't seem to make up your mind. I understand sexuality just fine, thank you.
As far as my saying "get over it", you are the only one who can change your view of the world. Sure, there are always people who will find something to dislike you for like race or weight, or you wear glasses, whatever. But only you can allow them to affect you. We are all guilty of this and just need to try to "get over it".
Like I said, the world is what you make of it.
I and many here can sense your anger. Why not do something creative with it instead of trying to make everyone see your way only and lashing out at strangers on the Internet?

[mercedesjin]

Originally Posted by bELyVIS

How am I racist? You were the one upset that you felt other races thought black people less attractive. I have seen many attractive black women. Wouldn't you say it is racist to assume another race finds your race unattractive? You are the one with the problem about your race. No one here said anything bad that I remember and certainly not I.
How am I sexist? I never said women were inferior. My whole thing about relationships goes back to how traditional relationships were and are based, the man is the head of the family. The reason that this is a problem nowadays is that men are still being taught this role while women are being taught to be independent. This makes the man feel like he has failed in his role. Equal roles in this relationship will cause a power struggle. Now I am not saying women can't be equal in this relationship, most women know how to persuade a man to give into her thinking. This has been happening since the beginning of time and still does. My wife is very skilled at this and she gets her way without making my role feel threatened.
Did you not claim you were gay and then bisexual? Why would submitting to a man be a part of these relationships? I never said that you have to submit to anyone so quit putting words into my mouth. Even in gay relationships one takes a dominant role and the other submissive. Too equals will again cause a power struggle. You need to find out which you prefer and go from there. I know what I am, but you can't seem to make up your mind. I understand sexuality just fine, thank you.
As far as my saying "get over it", you are the only one who can change your view of the world. Sure, there are always people who will find something to dislike you for like race or weight, or you wear glasses, whatever. But only you can allow them to affect you. We are all guilty of this and just need to try to "get over it".
Like I said, the world is what you make of it.
I and many here can sense your anger. Why not do something creative with it instead of trying to make everyone see your way only and lashing out at strangers on the Internet?

LO fucking L. Seriously? Dude, seriously? Seriously. Okay. I have been attacked and insulted on this forum left and right. I'm sick of it. And, when I dish a little bit of it back out, people flip the fuck out. Oh Lord. Oh Christ. If I weren't so annoyed, I'd think that was hilarious.

I said you were racist because you don't seem to think that my heritage amounts to anything. I said you were sexist because you've just spent the last couple of pages trying to convince me that women should take the traditional, inferior role of woman for a relationship to work. I'm a woman. I've been with men before. As far as I'm concerned, you automatically put me under the category of "woman" and the apparent requirement that I consider myself inferior.

You're still trying to argue with me about my own sexuality. I think even you can see how silly that is.

I and many modern-day scholars strongly agree with your idea of queer men and women needing to have someone who takes the dominant role. That role is something that stems from heterosexuality. These couples are not heterosexual. They automatically break out of traditional roles. It's true that some, unfortunately, see heterosexual couples and believe that they must mold their own relationship on the idea that one must go out and make money while the other stays home. Most, however, break out of those boundaries and seek true equality.

Thank God no one from the past took the advice you're trying to give me, because I'd be out working the plantation fields right now if they did.

As for "creative" outlets: I've worked with filmmaking, I sell paintings, I'm a teacher's assistant so that I can positively influence student's lives everyday, and I'm working to get published. What's with people on the Internet assuming that they know every little thing about me?

[Koir]

Originally Posted by mercedesjin

What's with people on the Internet assuming that they know every little thing about me?

What's with you turning every little thing into a race debate with you in the right and everyone else (having a different opinion) in the wrong?